Here's what "The Boob" and his Mensys shill are selling eCS v1.2 for.
These prices are taken directly from Mensys. It 'appears" (but not made
clear) the purchase of the Upgrade application package will entitle the
buyer to participate in the beta testing of SVista. Upon reaching an
SVista GA, the buyer will be required to pay an additional $50 for the
single host SVista version. To run other two operating systems under
SVista you will have to pay an additional ($99 as well as purchase those
'other' operating systems). Ok, here we go:

Upgrading from eCS v1.1:

Upgrade eCS v1.2 from v1.1 - $ 59.00
Upgrade application package - $99
Subscription for v1.2 - $69
Subscription for application package - $69

Total cost to the eCS Luser who has already paid over $300 for the
combined Preview and eCS v1.0 and 1.1:

$296

Include the GA cost for SVista ($50): $346
Add the GA cost for multiple SVista platforms ($99): $445

Add in everything together - from Preview ($99) through eCS v1.0 ($149),
v1.1 ($300) and v1.2 ($445) and the whopping cost of eCS v1.2 is:

$1,438.00

This figure does not include shipping, handling and "stocking" fees.

If you are so stupid to pay this kind of money for a bastardized version
of Warp 4.52 then you truly are an eCS Luser.

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

Bob St.John wrote:
THESE are prices YOU suggested, NOT what your distributors charged.
Let's remember here Boob, you don't sell eCS yourself. You leave it up
to your greedy distributors. Reminder: MOST of your distributors have
fled. You are now forced to sell eCS out of Canada (Troughton) and The
Netherlands (Klein).

Preview was NOT free. eCS v1.0 was NOT free.

Reminder: Those who bought eCS ended up with a problematic bastardized
version of OS/2 that *to this day* fails to work properly.

FUBAR. BALONEY. SWC was $125 and NOT available for the 2004-2005
subscription, Passport Express took it's place at just $62.50. Total
SWC cost: $302.50

Reminder: Those who bought SWC got a premier working operating system.

eComstation is no where near comparable to IBM. You sold just a handful
of eCS and of those who bought it found it failed for them. They moved
on to Microsoft and Linux. Cost of eCS v1.0 to the OS/2 community:
detrimental

Which no one needs, wants or is using today.

Freely available.

LotusSmart Suite ($180),

Which 99% of all OS/2 users already had/have.

a lot of other good software.

All available for free.

Total value of this deal: Zilch

Doesn't work, is quite useless, and can't/won't replace SS/2. Can be
purchased for a minial cost from Innotek.

Value: Zilch

There is no such product at all and you know it. There is a "maybe
someday we'll have this product and you'll have to pay up the nose for a
full working copy" but today, there is just another one of Serenity's
failed promises.

Even if SVista/2 comes to completion the cost of hardware to run it is
beyond the scope of 95% of all OS/2 users. The poor performance of a
'virtual OS' within an OS is even more detrimental.

Value: Hot Air and ZILCH.

No one wanted Connectix which is why it doesn't exist today. THAT
should have been a clue to the eCS Lusers who bought into your
stupidity. Had you undertook a plan to bring a Real Audio Player/2,
WebCam/2, WebPhone/2, Movie Maker/2, Media Player/2, Embellish v3.0,
Colorworks v3.0, or any of hundreds of useful needed applications to the
OS/2 arena, you might scare up a few sales.

You didn't because it was cheaper to string people along with a silly
product like "SVista".

Value: Zilch

No need to even bring it up other then to use the moment to illegally
promote a failed product. I'll edit it out for my readers.

Reminder: for the $356 you cite the buyer ends up with a poor working
problematic operating system that fails to reach the level of OS/2 Warp
4.52 today.

Value: Zilch

All are clearly available in a variety of ways for the Warp 4.52 user:
SWC/PA, XNap, Limewire, other OS/2 users.

The honest truth is that eComstation has been a rip-off from day one
providing little more than a problematic poor operating system that few
people want or need.

You have continually failed to 'deliver'. You promised eCS v1.2 on June
30th. Today is August 22nd. JUST for this 1.2 version that is 54 days
late. Not one of your two distributors has this product to provide to
any pre-buyer today and there is no date provided by your two
distributors as to when a pre-buyer may actually receive such a product.

eCS v1.0 and v1.1 was months late.

Consistant delivery is a joke despite your glossy claims.

You've dilvered no value to the eCS Luser, OS/2 user and you've worked
to destroy the OS/2 community.

Yes it is, thousands of complaints posted in newsgroups by just a
handful of eCS Lusers. You've never been able to sell eCS to any
Enterprise customer and have covered that fact by claiming you can't
release the names of your customers.

LOL! Yes, all six of your investors. They HAVE to. They ARE INVESTED
and can't go anywhere else. They either vote for eCS or lose their
investment. Complain publicly and you ban them from your privately
controlled eCS advertising forums. You fudge the votes and can't
provide one iota of truth to back up your facetious polls. You know
what's sad (and quite telling) is the low number of those supposed votes
in favor of eCS. Somehow, amazingly, astonishingly, from out of thin
air, you found more than 200 OS/2 users when every poll taken anywhere
else can barely find 200 OS/2 users.

It's called misnomer marketing, a trick you learned well from Loonytoony
Cheung, you're former partner. The guy who took a hike when the balloon
deflated on eCS.

You're an idiot but you know that. No one needs or wants either of the
two products noted above but keep believing yourself because you make it
easy for us to ridicule eCS, you and Serenity itself.

No no no. THANK YOU for freaking out and responding to my posts with
all your glib marketing crap. You do more harm to eCS sales then your
idiotic German salesmen, Herbutt Rosenau. That poor guy hasn't seen a
sale of eCS in so long he is going berserk stammering in every newsgroup
he can weasle his way into.

I know my work is appreciated when you come in here worried to death
over the truth of my eCS facts.

Now give these kind folks a realistic date for delivery - ACTUAL
delivery - of eCS v1.2.

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

This could have been a worthwhile exercise if someone did it properly.
However, "TM"'s example has the user buying some products two, or in the
case of SVISTA, three times, to inflate the total. And to help things
along in that direction ... "silly math" enters the picture.

The OS/2 Guy wrote:
<snip>
First $99 + $149 + $300 + $445 = $993
Second, your selection of pricing is FUBAR

$139 for eComStation 1.0 (before GA, Preview was provided at no charge)
$89 for eComStation Upgrade Protection, provided 1.1 Entry and AppPack
$296 for 1.2, 1.2 Application Pack and Subscription Svcs for both
$524 total

Assuming someone could find and buy SWC for 2000=2001, 2002-2003,
2004-2005, that cost would be $540. eComStation is less expensive than
SWC over this period. Feel free to insert other prices, including the
new PA pricing.

eComStation pricing is comparable to IBM. But consider that the user who
puchased eComStation at 1.0 at $139 could have stopped there and still
received all the software that iBM made available on SWC and DDPak
online over the next five years at no additional cost.

That same $139 expenditure entitled the user to HOBLink ($200),
StarOffice, LotusSmart Suite ($180), a lot of other good software.

And, since the Application Pack 1.2 was included in "TM" pricing, keep
in mind that SSI provided OS/2 users with OpenOffice.org/2, not IBM. And
SVISTA/2, a virtual machine product which supports OS/2 as both host and
guest. When Connectix sold this product, it was over $200. Now .. it
doesn't exist.

It is inappropriate to bring the multi-platform into an eComStation
pricing because they are separate. However, if one wanted a Linux host,
VMWare has one for $199. Want a Windows host?, another $199. Want OS/2
support as a guest on those? Not available. Want OS/2 or FreeBSD hosts?
Not available. So, the SVISTA multi-platform, at GA, will be a special
value, but not part of eComStation.

But what if a user didn't want all those applications? Well, then the
pricing goes more like:

$139 for eComStation 1.0 ($239 after promotional pricing)
$89 for Upgrade Protection to 1.1 (optional)
$59 for the 1.2 upgrade (optional)
$69 for the Subscription service (optional)
$356 Total ($456 if 1.0 ordered after the promo price expired)

I indicate "optional" because users continued to get access to updates,
fixes, and drivers, even if they remained on 1.0. With SWC or PA, the
user must continually renew to have access.

The simple truth is that in 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, eComStation
has provided a valuable set of options to OS/2 users ... that's a long
time and a consistent record of delivering product, delivering value,
protecting customer investment, and being responsive to users. That is a
public record, easy to see.

eComStation users continue to give it high marks, making it the OS/2
User Poll Commercial Product of the Year.

And SSI, with OpenOffice.org/2 and SVISTA, continues to invest in
solutions for OS/2 users. Options, choices, value ... sounds OK to me.

Again, "TM", thank you for a marketing moment.

Regards,
Bob St.John
Serenity Systems International

In <41289D63.7080701@Augustmail.com>, on 08/22/2004
at 08:19 AM, "Bob St.John" <Serenity@Augustmail.com> said:

Stop the lies -- Once you buy SWC, the annual renewal was never as
expensive as you are claiming.

One would think that after you been publicly admonished for your lies
here, that you would grow up and act like a decent human after a time. --
You never do that. Its why you and your product are failure. Its also why
IBM got rid of you.

letoured@nospam.net wrote:

No lie. Just the facts. In 2000, SWC was only available as a 2 year
subscription and the lower prices cited right here were around $180. And
the "renewal" was the same as the "purchase" price, around $180, some
folks paid more.

Now, with PA, a user can get an "after license agreement" for about
$155, and media for another $15 or so. That covers one year. Then the
renewal is about $55 .. so the two year price actually goes up unless a
user gets the option of only purchasing renewals.

These PA one year renewals are a recent additon, not available in 2000,
2001, 2002, and 2003 .. users who wanted access to the IBM software
through SWC paid about $180 for a two year SWC subscription. Look it up
if you need to ..

And all the user received was the same IBM software eComStation 1.0
users have had access to for five years now, at no additional cost. No
reason to "renew" and no reason to upgrade other than a desire to
acquire something in the upgrade. The faucet was not turned off, forcing
a renewal for access.
<snip>

Regards,
Bob St.John
Serenity Systems International

Are you *sure* "TM" (and his multiple disordered personalities) aren't
on your payroll, manufacturing these 'marketing moments' for you, Bob?

MB


On 08/22/04 09:19 am Bob St.John put fingers to keyboard and launched
the following message into cyberspace:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 15:08:12 UTC, "Bob St.John"
<Serenity@Augustmail.com> wrote:

(etc.)

Bob

I have eCS 1.1 with the AP.

I see the upgrade on the Mensys site; no problem there. But the AP
upgrade seems to be from 1.0 (at a price about twice that of the eCS 1.1
-> 1.2 uprade). I see no 1.1 -> 1.2 upgrade for the AP...

Can you explain, please?

(the 1.1->1.2 upgrade for MP is however only 1 euro...!)

Bob Eager wrote:

Can you give me a URL? Something doesn't sound right ..

The info I'm giving you is from the pdf file which is available on
http://www.eComStation.com, all prices US dollars SRP.

The upgrade price from 1.0 or from Application Pack 1.1 are both $99US.

Consider that eComStation 1.0 had the "Application Pack 1.0" bundled
into the product; SmartSuite, HOBLink, Applause, the contents which were
unbundled in Application Pack 1.1. So the upgrade to Application Pack
1.2 would be from eComStation 1.0 or Application Pack 1.1.

The reason the price is the same is because the Application Pack 1.2
includes SVISTA/2 and OpenOffice.org/2, SmartSuite. Since both
eComStation 1.0 and Application Pack 1.1 users are licensed for Smart
Suite, the different content is the same for both groups, 1.0 and
Application Pack 1.1. .. so the price is the same.

Regards,
Bob St.John
Serenity Systems International

Minnie Bannister wrote:

Amazing, isn't it? And "Ed" is moving right up there, too.

Regards,
Bob St.John
Serenity Systems International

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 22:27:10 UTC, "Bob St.John"
<Serenity@Augustmail.com> wrote:


<http://shop.mensys.nl/cgi-bin/db2www...catname=eComSt
ation>

OK; Mensys just don't mention 1.1 at all as an upgrade starting point
for the AP. Unless I missed something.

And does the $1.00 for the 1.1->1.2 MP upgrade sound right?

David H. McCoy wrote:
And where would one go to purchase VirtualPC for OS/2?

And even when the product WAS available for the OS/2 platform NO ONE
WANTED the damn thing!

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

Minnie Bannister wrote:
I notice "MB" that you haven't plopped down your $296 for eCS v1.2.
What are YOU waiting for?

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

Andy Willis wrote:
Actually Andy, I look forward to your eCS purchase and prod you into
doing so today. The quicker you buy the faster we can all laugh at your
confirmed stupidity. You entered these newsgroups with no 'light in the
attic' and we'd all be disappointed to think of you any differently today.

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

The OS/2 Guy wrote:
As was already pointed not only can you not add (and apparently can't
use a calculator either) but your calculations are skewed. If you
bought the eCS 1.0 preview that bought you eCS 1.0 so one or the other
cost has to be dropped. The subsciptions are not required so anyone
buying them must feel they offer something they need. The application
package includes svista for eCS\OS/2 thus that cost is out of it. The
mulitple package is only needed if you run on a system other than
eCS\OS/2 thus cannot be realistically added to the cost of eCS (caveat:
if you were going to run eCS under linux\bsd\etc. you could add the
cost but that is more like a hardware cost in reality thus if you bought
a new machine to run eCS on then you could always add that cost and
really skew things).
Cost breakdown:
without subscriptions:
eCS\application pak: $158 (this includes svista and OpenOffice which
would cost ~$100 on their own).
With subscription: $296
TCC:
149+89+296=534
This assumes that you did not take advantage of the preview price, that
you did buy the upgrade protection and now the subscription -- I may be
misremembering the price on upgrade protection possibly only $69). I
did buy upgrade but may not buy subscriptions so my total price in that
case would be $396 though the more you point out the incredible deal
that serenity offers I may have to buy the subscriptions too.
I believe however, that someone probably should report Tim Martin as he
really should not be advertising for Serenity in these newsgroups this way.
Andy
A true OS/2 user and happy Serenity customer

Bob Eager wrote:
Right .. I sent them an email but to be clear, the upgrade would be from
Application Pack 1.1 .. not eComStation (Entry) 1.1.

I'm not sure what that is, but the MP package was not upgraded with 1.2
... it's essentially the same SMP from WSeb, not eComStation version
dependent.

Regards,
Bob St.John
Serenity Systems International

In article <4128b6fd_4@news3.prserv.net>, OS2Guy@GMail.com says...
it does exist. In fact, I'm glad it does because thanks to VirtualPC,
VMWare(the one I use) increased their total VM memory support from 1 gig
to 3.6. And all as a free upgrade from version 4 to version 4.5x.
--
--------------------------------------
David H. McCoy


--------------------------------------

David H. McCoy wrote:
what was referenced.
Andy

--
Warpstock 2004, Denver, Colorado, October 21 - 24, 2004
http://www.warpstock.org Volunteers: please send note to
wsv2004@comcast.net

Andy Willis wrote:
The firgures have been confirmed by "The Boob" himself. Here, let me
repeat the exchange between "the Boob" and an eCS Luser who sat in
amazement at the exchange. Please note the second exchange. That's the
killer:

"Let me see....do I have this right, Bob?

upgrade from 1.1 -- $59 (Bob: yes)
upgrade from app pk $99 (not a full version of SVista only the host, I
think)(Bob: The "host" is OS/2. What is true is that the Application
Pack does not include the support for the other hosting platforms,
Windows,Linux, and FreeBSD. )
subscription for 1.2 $69 at time of purchase of 1.2 (Bob: correct)
subscription for app pk $69 at time of purchase of app pk (Bob: Correct.)

So that's $296?? (Bob points to Mensys)"

'Bob, that isn't what you promised us when you started promoting 1.2.
You said those of us with previous versions would receive a substantial
savings on the 1.2 upgrade. "Substantial" would have been something in
the $100 ballpark for the full upgrade package. Now you hand us a $300
surprise. You did the same thing with v1.1 and the Preview. I'm stuck
between a rock and a hardplace because I can't go anywhere else without
losing everything I've invested. I can't afford the the $296 upgrade
price. Well, I can afford it, I just don't feel it is worth it. If you
can't come down on that price I'll consider unloading my eCS and moving
to Mandrake because I can't stand the idea of being forced off to
Microsoft.'

Obviously Andy, as a desperate eCS Investor now feeling the big fat hand
of "The Boob" in your back pocket, you *like* the feel of an old man's
hands on your ass. You prove that with your willingness lie and fudge
the truth to the potential eCS customer. I thank you. You add
credibility to the claim that eCS is a SCAM schlepped by gutter-cons.

And I'll repeat my excitement over your expected $296 eCS purchase and
urge you, tonight, to contact Roddy at Mensys. He says eCS v1.2 is
being downloaded this very minute by the only phantom eCS Luser
privileged to do so. Like the evasive and stealth eCS Enterprise
customer - Roddy is unable to reveal the name of the downloader and the
downloader hasn't trumpeted his success in any of the eCS private or
public forums but hey, he's probably fearful of that evil Microsoft who
will target their eCS operated computer and work to destroy the
eComstation fantasy world you six eCS Lusers live in. :-)

Tim Martin, The Official and Only OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site - http://www.warpcity.com
email: OS2Guy@Gmail.com

The OS/2 Guy wrote:
you do with simple addition. Maybe you should consider taking a
remedial arithmetic class.
Andy
A true OS/2 user and happy Serenity customer.
--
Warpstock 2004, Denver, Colorado, October 21 - 24, 2004
http://www.warpstock.org Volunteers: please send note to
wsv2004@comcast.net

In <4128B6DC.1070500@Augustmail.com>, on 08/22/2004
at 10:08 AM, "Bob St.John" <Serenity@Augustmail.com> said:

Yes it is booby. You give IBM retail prices -- when you know that SWC was
widely discounted -- yet for your own prouct you use the discounted prices
to make the comparison.

You're a slimeball snake oil salesman. Its why you have no ecs enterprise
cusomers. No one with a brain trusts you -- and you prove it all over
again every time you show up here with your deceitful behavior.
















Just the facts. In 2000, SWC was only available as a 2 year