News.individual.net, does anyone know if there is a problem with this
news server just now?
--
Derrick Fawsitt

On Fri, 1 Apr 2005 10:41:51 UTC, Derrick Fawsitt
<46@fitzwilliamonline.com> wrote:

Working fine here.

I take it you HAVE paid your 10 euro subscription (starts today)?
--
[ 7'ism - a condition by which the sufferer experiences an inability
to give concise answers, express reasoned argument or opinion.
Usually accompanied by silly noises and gestures - incurable, early
euthanasia recommended. ]

Derrick Fawsitt wrote:
Nope, nothing wrong, you just need to pay to use it now.

See the website.

--
The Caretaker .........

In message <hLxIhZBvVSTCFwvt@fitzwilliamonline.com>, Derrick Fawsitt
<46@fitzwilliamonline.com> writes
Yes. Unless you have paid 10 euros for a year's use you won't be able to
use it any more.
--
Pete Devlin
[{//////news03//////at\\\\\secondrow/////co\\\\\uk}]
"Mind the oranges Marlon!"

Derrick Fawsitt wrote:
" News.individual.net, does anyone know if there is a problem with this
news server just now? "


http://news.individual.net/

Derrick Fawsitt wrote:
Not if you've paid your 10 euros ;-)

Ivor

Derrick Fawsitt wrote:

Astro turfers now have to pay individual.net money and in the
process leave an audit trail.

For this we must now work together to legalize nefarious
astro turfing activities. I have put together a bill of rights for
astro turfers; please comment.

Note that I have added an extra section 13 that
allows for puppet master certification.

Legalise astro turfing now!
---------------------------

The rights of astro turfers are in danger because uk.telecom.broadband
is a place where they are continually bashed for fun.
This is not fair on the bashees and the bashers
because of nym shifting and other issues that are
making life difficult for point scoring to stick.
Astro turfing now is a big industry and part of
the landscape of the services industry.
Obviously employees must now be given extra rights.


The Engines of Democracy Astro Turfing Rights Bill
--------------------------------------------------
1. All astro turfers must register for employment and obtain employee ID.

2. Clients are nice people too, and deserve every contract to be
***to*be*displayed*openly*with*a*contract*ID*so*th at*everyone*may*know
***astroturfing*company*/*client*relationship*and*how*much*money
***has*parted*hands.*Particularly*important*for*po liticos*who
***are*worried*of*excessive*spending*by*the*other* side.

3. All astro turfers must show their employer registration ID, and client
***contract*ID*with*any*works*of*art*and*fiction*t hey*produce.
***In*return*legal*immunity*is*provided*to*the*ast ro*turfer,
***the*client*and*astroturfing*from*any*prosecutio n*for*opionins
***expressed,*except*for*anything*that*falls*under *existing*libel*laws.

4. Failure to do so can net unlimited liability for its employers
***and*the*clients*who*use*the*services.

5. This allows all astro turfed hooting tooting votes and opinions
***to*be*counted*as*just*one*vote*and*make*democra cy*work*fairly.

6. Bring astro turfing in line with current advertising rules
***i.e.*a.*they*must*be*factual
********b.*they*have*been*refereed
********c.*they*have*paid*tax

7. Any mis information reported by astro turfers is subject
***to*laws*of*libel,*and*through*use*of*employee*I D,*can
***render*the*employee,*the*employer*and*the*clien t*liable.

8. All astro turfers have the right to snitch on their employers
***and*clients*with*legal*protection*from*the*law* if*they
***choose*to*do*so.*That*is*employers and clients*must*not*compel
***employees*into*signing*any*agreements*that*proh ibit*their
***god*given*rights*of*freedom*of*speech.

9. Public companies must register transactions with astro turfing
***companies*and*make*available*to*investors*and*t he*SEC*the*full
***nature*of*the*contract*between*them*and*their*a stro*turfing
***companies*so*that*investors*can*be*confident*of *the*investments
***they*are*making,*and*that*it*is*not*based*on*fa ked*misinformation
***inadvertently*supplied*by*astro*turfers.

Client and Employer Misconduct
------------------------------

10. Should the employer or the Client is found to be in misconduct
***when*hiring*astro*turfers*to*put*out*incorrect* information,
***the*client*and*the*employer*gurantees*to*indemn ify*the*employee
***from*any*cost*arising*out*of*litigation.

Disabilities allowance
----------------------

11. Its widely accepted that disabled people and housewives
***are*used*for*astro*turfing*as*they*are*likely*t o*sit
***in*front*of*a*computer*and*type*out*nonsense*al l*day.
***For*those*disabled*people*that*are*housewives*o r*that*have*to
***operate*a*computer*without*an*arm,*or*a*leg,*or *a*brain,
***we*demand*that*pay*is*equal*to*that*of*fit*and* lifeless
***colleagues.

Career progression
------------------

12. No astro turd likes being called an idiot. Its un-winnable to argue
***a*point*when*you*are*an*astro*turd*and*have*no* qualifications.
***So*we*need*an*astro*turfing*institute*where*we* can*hoof*and*poof
***and*gain*merits*for*our*nefarious*activities.
***All*qualifications*shall*be*cited*with*employee *ID*and*client
***contract*ID*as*part*of*the*legal*requirement*to *become
***a*qualified*astro*turfer.

Puppet Master Authentication
----------------------------

13. Astro turfers have the right to know who they are ultimately working
for. Thus we propose all contracts be signed by the actual
puppet master(s) names that has instigated the action as opposed
to their paid minions or suckered bum boys. There can be no
transferrance of this responsibility. I.e. as a puppet master, you
cannot legally claim you were acting under orders.
Each named person must take full personal responsibility
or none at all and be prosecuted for fraud.

7 wrote:

You leave an audit trail whoever you use.

You are like a piece of gum on the sole of my shoe - very irritating and
difficult to get rid of. I am scraping you off now and into the
killfile. Bye.

What is an Astro Turfer please, you keep on about them!

Dave

- -
For what we are about to balls up may common sense prevent us doing it
again
in the future!!

Dave Stanton wrote:


It used to mean groups of people regularly posting letters
to politicians to instigate some policy. i.e. fake grass roots activism
hence astro turf - or fake grass grass.

But with the advent of internet, it has taken on a whole new dimension.
There are tens of thousands of people gainfully employed by the likes
of DCI and other corportations in america to write fake letters on contract
to companies as a business, and whats more these people are employed
to populate newsgroups, blogs, bbs, chat channels, and any other
internet medium you can think of with their rants day in day out.
One poster alone had posted 10,000 posts to zdnet for example praising
microshaft products.

Its getting to a stage where some definite action needs to be taken
because astro turfers rely on anonymity to be convincing,
but they have reached such a level of nuisance, its
time to add some employee ID or some contract ID on their
works to legally separate ordinary content
from those manufactured by astro turfers.

Its a big service industry, thats grown big and troublesome
of its own accord without controls and government statistics.

So we need some kind of controls put in place to identify the clients
of astro turfers, their projects, and the astro turfers themselves
so whenever they post something, it can all be tracked back to the
puppet masters that are orchestrating these playskool activities.

Methinks its foil hat time.....

Dave

--
For what we are about to balls up may common sense prevent us doing it
again
in the future!!

uni-berlin.de!individual.net sock puppet wrote:

BWAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHHAAAAH!!!!
Its alright 'Dave'. I believe you.

On Fri, 1 Apr 2005 17:40:42 UTC, 7
<website_has_email@www.ecu.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

So why do you accuse people on here of being astro turfers, when they
clearly have *not* hidden their identify, use real email addresses,
etc.?

Unlike you...who seem to fulfil that requirement nicely...

--
[ 7'ism - a condition by which the sufferer experiences an inability
to give concise answers, express reasoned argument or opinion.
Usually accompanied by silly noises and gestures - incurable, early
euthanasia recommended. ]

uni-berlin.de!individual.net sock puppet wrote:


BAHAHAHAAAHAHHAHAAHAHHHAAAAAAH!!!!
uni-berlin.de!individual.net sock puppet

On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 17:40:42 GMT, 7
<website_has_email@www.ecu.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

You are Maurice Kellett and I claim my hundred pounds.

On Fri, 1 Apr 2005 19:16:53 UTC, 7
<website_has_email@www.ecu.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

No answer to that then - 7'ism again.

--
[ 7'ism - a condition by which the sufferer experiences an inability
to give concise answers, express reasoned argument or opinion.
Usually accompanied by silly noises and gestures - incurable, early
euthanasia recommended. ]

uni-berlin.de!individual.net sock puppet wrote:

Awe pleashease!
I'm trying to legalise astro turfing and you are not helping.
This requires urgent political action.

Please comment below:

Legalise astro turfing now!
---------------------------

The rights of astro turfers are in danger because uk.telecom.broadband
is a place where they are continually bashed for fun.
This is not fair on the bashees and the bashers
because of nym shifting and other issues that are
making life difficult for point scoring to stick.
Astro turfing now is a big industry and part of
the landscape of the services industry.
Obviously employees must now be given extra rights.


The Engines of Democracy Astro Turfing Rights Bill
--------------------------------------------------
1. All astro turfers must register for employment and obtain employee ID.

2. Clients are nice people too, and deserve every contract to be
***to*be*displayed*openly*with*a*contract*ID*so*th at*everyone*may*know
***astroturfing*company*/*client*relationship*and*how*much*money
***has*parted*hands.*Particularly*important*for*po liticos*who
***are*worried*of*excessive*spending*by*the*other* side.

3. All astro turfers must show their employer registration ID, and client
***contract*ID*with*any*works*of*art*and*fiction*t hey*produce.
***In*return*legal*immunity*is*provided*to*the*ast ro*turfer,
***the*client*and*astroturfing*from*any*prosecutio n*for*opionins
***expressed,*except*for*anything*that*falls*under *existing*libel*laws.

4. Failure to do so can net unlimited liability for its employers
***and*the*clients*who*use*the*services.

5. This allows all astro turfed hooting tooting votes and opinions
***to*be*counted*as*just*one*vote*and*make*democra cy*work*fairly.

6. Bring astro turfing in line with current advertising rules
***i.e.*a.*they*must*be*factual
********b.*they*have*been*refereed
********c.*they*have*paid*tax

7. Any mis information reported by astro turfers is subject
***to*laws*of*libel,*and*through*use*of*employee*I D,*can
***render*the*employee,*the*employer*and*the*clien t*liable.

8. All astro turfers have the right to snitch on their employers
***and*clients*with*legal*protection*from*the*law* if*they
***choose*to*do*so.*That*is*employers and clients*must*not*compel
***employees*into*signing*any*agreements*that*proh ibit*their
***god*given*rights*of*freedom*of*speech.

9. Public companies must register transactions with astro turfing
***companies*and*make*available*to*investors*and*t he*SEC*the*full
***nature*of*the*contract*between*them*and*their*a stro*turfing
***companies*so*that*investors*can*be*confident*of *the*investments
***they*are*making,*and*that*it*is*not*based*on*fa ked*misinformation
***inadvertently*supplied*by*astro*turfers.

Client and Employer Misconduct
------------------------------

10. Should the employer or the Client is found to be in misconduct
***when*hiring*astro*turfers*to*put*out*incorrect* information,
***the*client*and*the*employer*gurantees*to*indemn ify*the*employee
***from*any*cost*arising*out*of*litigation.

Disabilities allowance
----------------------

11. Its widely accepted that disabled people and housewives
***are*used*for*astro*turfing*as*they*are*likely*t o*sit
***in*front*of*a*computer*and*type*out*nonsense*al l*day.
***For*those*disabled*people*that*are*housewives*o r*that*have*to
***operate*a*computer*without*an*arm,*or*a*leg,*or *a*brain,
***we*demand*that*pay*is*equal*to*that*of*fit*and* lifeless
***colleagues.

Career progression
------------------

12. No astro turd likes being called an idiot. Its un-winnable to argue
***a*point*when*you*are*an*astro*turd*and*have*no* qualifications.
***So*we*need*an*astro*turfing*institute*where*we* can*hoof*and*poof
***and*gain*merits*for*our*nefarious*activities.
***All*qualifications*shall*be*cited*with*employee *ID*and*client
***contract*ID*as*part*of*the*legal*requirement*to *become
***a*qualified*astro*turfer.

Puppet Master Authentication
----------------------------

13. Astro turfers have the right to know who they are ultimately working
***for.*Thus*we*propose*all*contracts*be*signed*by *the*actual
***puppet*master(s)*names*that*has*instigated*the* action*as*opposed
***to*their*paid*minions*or*suckered*bum*boys.*The re*can*be*no
***transferrance*of*this*responsibility.*I.e.*as*a *puppet*master,*you
***cannot*legally*claim*you*were*acting*under*orde rs.
***Each*named*person*must*take*full*personal*respo nsibility
***or*none*at*all*and*be*prosecuted*for*fraud.

On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 18:24:17 +0100, Dave Stanton <me@privacy.net>
wrote:

They are a figment of his imagination.

I have never heard the term used by anybody else.

It *may* be used in the original context he mentioned, it certainty
isn't in the internet context.

And he is totally wrong about these people becoming such a nuisance
that something "needs to be done". They are so rare as to be
insignificant in most groups.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
I didn't know it was impossible when I did it.

To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 21:42:20 GMT, 7
<website_has_email@www.ecu.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

Based on your "definition" of astro-turfing, there are none in this
newsgroup.

So obviously, they don't get "bashed for fun".
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
I didn't know it was impossible when I did it.

To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

"7" <website_has_email@www.ecu.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:uIf3e.1749$G8.510@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk. ..
Well, that would make you an 'Astro Turfer' as it's you who keeps
posting long irrelevant trolls to this group...