Excuse me!!
Would you stop for a moment?!
O...man...Haven't you thought-one day- about yourself ?
Who has made it?
Have you seen a design which hasn't a designer ?!
Have you seen a wonderful,delicate work without a worker ?!
It's you and the whole universe!..
Who has made them all ?!!
You know who ?.. It's "ALLAH",prise be to him.
Just think for a moment.
How are you going to be after death ?!
Can you believe that this exact system of the universe and all of
these great creation will end in in nothing...just after death!
Have you thought, for a second, How to save your soul from Allah's
punishment?!
Haven't you thought about what is the right religion?!
Read ... and think deeply before you answer..
It is religion of Islam.
It is the religion that Mohammad-peace upon him- the last prophet,
had
been sent by.
It is the religion that the right Bible- which is not distorted-has
preached.
Just have a look at The Bible of (Bernaba).
Don't be emstional.
Be rational and judge..
Just look..listen...compare..and then judge and say your word.
We advise you visiting :
http://www.islam-guide.com/
http://www.thetruereligion.org/
http://www.it-is-truth.org/
http://www.beconvinced.com/
http://www.plaintruth.org/
http://english.islamway.com/
http://www.todayislam.com/
http://www.prophetmuhammed.org/
http://www.islamtoday.net/english/
http://www.islamunveiled.org/
http://www.islamic-knowledge.com/

We willingly recive any inquries at the e-mail :


musl...@hotmail.com


http://www.islam-qa.com


Or


http://www.islam-online.net/


Or


http://www.al-islam.com/


Or


http://www.al-sunnah.com/

aassime abdellatif wrote:

I try not to be a selfish self obsessed wanker, its true,.

I have

By definition, no. Tautology.

By definition, no. Tautology.

No, it isn't.

No one has made them all.

You can't even spell 'praise'

Piss off. you ignorant immature little god botherer.

You might fool the stupid, but you don't fool me.

"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
news:1197940490.27406.0@demeter.uk.clara.net...

god botherer would presuppose the existance a god to bother, which is
patently impossible as science and reason all but disproves it, "piss off
you ignorant little man" maybe a better response?

tony h wrote:

Someone who (attempts to) bother (non existent) unicorns.

"tony h" <me@home.com> wrote in message
news:fk8e69$avh$1@news.albasani.net...

Science has disproved God?! - when did this happen?

(you'll note the sarcasm of my question - it's always amusing to see
insignificant little men desperately attempting to deny the existence of He
who created all things - rather like a small group of ants confidently
announcing that man doesn't exist, seconds before a size 10 boot
inadvertently squashes 'em without even noticing

In message
<879612b8-c215-476c-972b-e7b3d1bcb0bb@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>,
aassime abdellatif <aassime1@hotmail.fr> wrote


Didn't Slartibartfast have something to do with it?

--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

national treasure wrote:

Actually, he said *all but* disproves God. You can't account for people whose
otherwise normally rational behaviour goes to pot when pressented with a faith
that requires belief without proof.


It's always amusing to see insignificant little men desperately attempting to
assert that the Universe was created by a 'man who lives in the sky' whose very
existence has never proven!

Jesus wept ! Do you believe in the tooth fairy too ?

Graham

Alan wrote:

Norway certainly.

Graham

"Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:47684BBB.E3283F03@hotmail.com...

I'm not *entirely* sure what is expected of me here. Presumably, you expect
me to swoon with horror at your carefully inserted (and rather silly, I
might say so) blasphemy. yes?

Not a chance - I've lived long enough to hear most of the profanities that
men employ when mocking the Saviour (although, doubtless, you have a few
more stashed away with which you will regale me)

We, Mr Donkey, are as frail as eggshells and as transient as grass. Men
recoil before the prospect of eternity (particularly so when they have
nagging foreboding about their own fate) and, in the best tradition of the
gallows humourist, will usually attempt to deride and ridicule that which
they secretly fear.

Life is all about choices - that's why we're here. You make your choice and
then you die with it (and, before you start caterwauling about an unjust God
who wickedly consigns people to hell, blah, blah, blah...) remember that we
*have* a choice. If we make the wrong one, then the fault lies with us,
surely?

Ahhhhh...Mr Donkey - truly, we are children of dust. A neighbour of mine
fell ill at the beginning of October ( a man who had never had a day's
serious illness in his life, btw) He will not see this Christmas because he
has already been cremated - life into death in less than six weeks!

Is it not sobering to realise that you, or I, might not live to see our
credit card bills arrive in January?

Choices, Mr Donkey - we make 'em, and they shape our fate in eternity. Yet
such is the foolishness of the human heart, men will put a great deal of
thought into their choice of broadband supplier - yet none into their
everlasting destination.

So, try not be an Ass, eh?

"national treasure" <laughing@thefrogs.com> wrote in message
news:5sr2e8F1b25mfU1@mid.individual.net...
surely a large part of your choice was being born in a predominately
christian country, and being indoctrinated into the christian faith, so that
you now 'know' about your god and saviour. many children are born in
countries with diffent gods and systems, just as you 'know' they are all
wrong and going to hell, they 'know' the same of you. as an athiest and a
rationalist i know that you're all wrong, but, should the evidence arrive to
prove that one of the multitude of faiths is absolutely correct i'm willing
to change my mind and be proved wrong

"tony h" <me@home.com> wrote in message
news:fk9l58$idp$1@news.albasani.net...

You're quite right - I believe in these things because I was fortunate
enough to have been brought up in (what was then) a nominally Christian
country.

You, as a rationalist, should be able to judge things by the way they work -
or don't work.

It's one of the great paradoxes that those born in the UK who openly deride
the gospel have, themselves, benefited hugely from it since their first
breath.

Christianity works - perhaps I should quality that by saying 'Protestant'
Christianity works. It brings the blessing of God upon the nations that
embrace it - and, conversely, idols and paganism bring a curse.

You might not want to admit that - but, as a rationalist, how can you deny
the evidence of your own eyes? However, it's a bitter irony that the very
thing that has made this country attractive to non-Christian immigrants is
being destroyed by 'multi-culturalism'

I speak, of course, of a Britain that has now mostly vanished. I would say
that the UK now carries an even greater curse upon it than the unhappy lands
in thrall to idols. We have abandoned virtually all pretence of Christian
belief, our very soil is soaked in the blood of millions of slaughtered
infants, homosexuals abound and prosper in positions of influence and power,
corruption is woven into the very fabric of our political and judicial life,
children are encouraged to copulate like animals, disease runs rampant,
brutality, hopelessness and despair abound.

Those who were keen to see the end of Christianity must be feeling
absolutely elated - they have finally built their own heaven upon earth.
It's an open sewer, of course - but they'd much rather wallow in filth than
humble themselves before a God whom they despise.

The only bright spot on the horizon is God's unbreakable promise that it
will soon be over. Roll on!!

national treasure wrote:

Its pretty hard to disprove something that changes according to the whim
of the individual believer.

However science has made god as an explanation less and less useful.

So nowadays we simply ignore Him, and mostly he goes away, and good
riddance.

Occam's razor state that 'entities should not be multiplied beyond
necessity' and there is no necessity for any God entities at all. So
they simply do not feature.

Thats what upsets the god botherers. They can cope with people
*disbelieving* in their crap, but they cannot stand the thought that
many people simply do not even bother to think about it whatsoever.

In short, If God doesn't exist, we have made the right choices, and if
he does, well I am sure, given the reasons why I don't give a flying
fuck about this sort of religion, he will understand and totally forgive
me ;-)


If not, hes an arsehole of the first order and I wouldn't be seen dead
in heaven anyway.

However I went through all that so many years ago I have lost count.
These days its like the tooth fairy. Nice story, makes the kids happy.
Period.

national treasure wrote:
Ohmigawd. A real piuus sincere one.

Tiptoe out chaps..don't rock his boat..


Men may do. I don't. Been there, done that.


I don;t have that. One day the worms will eat me. I hope they enjoy it
as much as last nights pork roast.


Not in the slightest. I don't fear death at all. I have in a way died
many times already.

I fear religion though. ESPECIALLY the sort of throw a bomb in your
face JESUS/ALLAH/THE END OF ALL THINGS IS NIGH sort of crap.


Prove it.

Life is about staying alive. Period. The secret of life is keeping
breathing. Give that up and your dead.

I don't make any issue about unjust gods who consign people to hell.
People are quite capable of doing that unassisted, - you are a typical
example. You are mired in the pit of your own (mis)conceoptions, and
will never rise above them. You have mistaken allegory fior phyiscal
fact, and missed the whole point of teh scriptures. *shrug* so what?
plenty like you.




So what?

old..


Prove it. We make ouyr choices - or do we? who made us make the choices
the way we do? Who made Him make HIS choices the way he did? infinite
recursion, if you want top pusue the myth of absolute cxausality to its
logical conclusion (confusion?)

You don;t know owt about science, and even less about the actual things
that drive life..and have totally missed the actual issues addressed in
religion, and gotten yourself stuck in a Death Cult.


<>Yet
Possibly because it actually produces some tangible results.

However judging by most of the posters here, religion still exists in
terms of brand awareness.

My God (ISP) is better than yuour God (ISP)

Frankly its all bollocks. And you should be old enough to have realised it.

Can YOU face the awful possibility that you might in fact be completely
wrong? I doubt it.



do not look in a mirror.

national treasure wrote:
Some of us do not deride it: we merely understand that its very
interesting, but has nothing to do with the 'God' that people like you
have supported. Jesus would laugh his fucking head off at you.


oh bloody hell. What a wanker you are!

Ever since the 1300's every ounce of progress has been won against the
constant backdrop of religious repression of ideas and free speech.

We are only protestant because Henry wanted a new shag bunny and his
wife was too old for the son he desperately needed to secure his dynasty.


Religion is and always has been since Peter a political tool. any
semblance of the Gospel as she was spoke has vanished in the mists of
time. Its just another political party, that very few people can be
bothered to vote for.



Christ Another fundy Xtian white supremacist..who has forgotten that
Jesus preached among non jews more than among jews. And preached charity
and good neighborliness. What an arsehole sized hypocrite.

"national treasure" <laughing@thefrogs.com> wrote in message
news:5sr8tbF1a5e38U1@mid.individual.net...

please don't feel that i jusy have a problem with christians, i have
exactly the same problem with muslims, jews, buddhists etc.
As to open sewer - where? i'm happily married, nice kids, ok house, job,
friends etc.. i don't remember when i last 'wallowed in filth' and i
certainly don't 'despise' your god, how could i despise something the
evidence tells me doesnt exist.
As open sewers go, i'd have a quick look in your bible to find some
horrendous stuff going on, your 'god of love' commandaing that all living
things, man, woman child and beast be killed in jericho. flooding the entire
planet and saving just 1 family and a handful of aninals, ordering abraham
to sacrifice his son isaac (apparently just a test, but pity the poor
child), lot offering his virgin daughters to the townsfolk of soddom and
gomorrh, the leaving with them as the town was destroyed, his wife being
turned into salt for looking back, then getting drunk that night and
impregnating his 2 daughters - this is the man your god saved!
i could mention 'original sin', every woman through history being punished
for the mistake of 1
or history itself - plenty of christians believe the world is 6000 years
old, regardless of the evidence to the contrary
or creation itself, ignoring darwin and all those since.

by having no god i make my own decisions and way in life, if i do something
wrong it is my responsibitly, 'the devil' did not make me do it, because,
like god, the devil does not exist.
when i die ( a moment i'm trying to put off for as long as i can) it will
all be over for me, i have no belief that i should put up with a a load of
crap in this life to be rewarded by a fantastic afterlife. your religion is
just a method of controlling the masses, and one that works very well, you
are more than welcome to believe whatever you lire (or are told by your
vicar) but as a being with consiousness you should be able to assess the
evidence and your beliefs should be based upon that. as i said earlier, to
me the evidence weighs heavily away from a god, but my mind is still open to
change
i am happy to have been born in britain, primarily because of the temperate
climate and lack of nasty creepy crawlies, not because its a nominally
protestant state,it also affords me the choice of what to believe, and
access to the alternatives, which many countries don't do, how can your god
condem an afghan muslim for not being a christian when he has never had
access to your bible? why is your branch of christianity the right one, not
jehovah's witnesses, or catholics, or one of the thousands of others? you
condem homosexuality, yet your church (in parts) allows gay clergy, which,
with my limited biblical knowledge is a very big no-no.

Suggested reading list - C. Dawin, R. Dawkins

"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
news:1198030829.49774.0@demeter.uk.clara.net...


Well, call me Mr Pedantic - but it is surely *you* who has embraced a 'death
cult' (and who appears to be thoroughly enjoying it!)

*I* have not live with the foreboding of death 'since I was 15 years old',
nor have I - in a way died many times already'! (perhaps, at this juncture,
it's worth remarking that you seem remarkably chipper for someone who has
trod the vale more often than a rambler on his favourite walk

'Life is about staying alive'...'keep breathing'....'give that up and you're
dead' - they seem rather desperate thoughts for someone who professes to be
unconcerned about death.

Actually, life *isn't* about staying alive - how could it possibly be so
since not one of us can escape death? We may defer it by good lifestyle
choices or good fortune - but, eventually, we *will* die.

You reduce life to a bestial struggle to keep one's soul in this world for
as long as possible - yet Jesus taught the opposite.

"Be not afraid of those who can kill the body - rather, fear those who can
kill the soul", "He that saveth his life shall lose it", "What shall it
profit a man if he gain the whole world, but lose his soul?"

Much as I tend to dislike pithy quotes from any source other than the bible,
I do find this particular saying (now, inexplicably attributed to a
gentleman by the name of Jim Elliot - but, as far as I know, from a much
earlier source, Count Nicholas Zinzendorf)

"He is no fool who gives that which he cannot keep to gain that which he
cannot lose"

The truth of the matter is that we will *all* live forever - it's *where* we
will be that counts.

No God?, mankind consisting only of chemicals?, no soul?............hardly!

By your logic we should all do whatever it takes to stay alive - kill,
steal, cheat, lie, betray, hate..........(and many do, of course) After
all, if I could gain one extra minute of life by cutting your throat, and
the throats of your family - wouldn't that be the 'sensible' thing for me to
do, based on *your* doctrine?

I'm going to assume that you have a family whom you love? - children for
whom you would give your life? - grandchildren who you would defend to the
death against those who would harm them? I have to ask *why* you would do
these things - it's simply not 'logical' - unless *you* are threatened, why
would *you* intervene?

Yet you *would* intervene - and you would do so because you love them. Not
with a physiological interaction of chemicals and neurons - but with
something intangible that lies deep within you. Something that, according
to you, shouldn't exist

'God is love', says the bible. Not *loving*, not prone to love, or disposed
towards love - but Love itself. Without Him there can be no love - it's an
impossibility. The fact that love still exists in this dying world should
be a testament to you of God's existence! - what we have are the vestigial
remnants of a deep and perfect love that is beyond our comprehension. When
this world finally ends that Love will be found only in the realm that we
call heaven - outside of which will be only darkness and an eternity cut off
completely from that Love - even by proxy.

Which is what Hell will be - not a fire-pit with pantomime devils, but an
aching void of fear, anguish and everlasting regret - the most violent
nightmare imaginable from which it will be impossible ever to wake.

You love your wife?, your mother?, your brother?, your friend? - not in Hell
you won't! - you won't be *able* to love them, for all love will have been
removed. There, you will torment them, and they will torment you - endless
fear and suffering - sharpened by the remembrance of those few years spent
on earth when you *could* have believed, but chose not to.

And, since we're talking of love - it was the love of God for you that
brought Him to that cow shed in Bethlehem, to live in isolation and
loneliness for 33 years before allowing Himself to be nailed to a cross -
for the sole purpose of providing us with an opportunity to live forever in
the love of Heaven instead of the anguish of Hell.

*Why*? - I dunno, not when I think about the wrong things I've done and the
mistakes I've made, *I* wouldn't die for someone like me! - yet He did,
presumably, because He is Love.


And, if *you* are wrong?...........

national treasure wrote:
Only in your biased eyes.


That logic defies belief!

That's why its a death cult. It worships and embraces death: If all
life is is a preparatin foir death,why not get it all over with and top
yourself now?



Yeah, keep on asking yourself those questions. You need to.



Bollocks. By any ordinary definition, and you have yourself just stated
the opposite, we will NOT live forever. Not indeed for very ling.

You need to decide what you mean by life. It can't be just this temporal
existence, or a supposed eternity as well. Its one or the other.

I know its very hard to make any rational sense of the Bible, but you
should at least make the effort.



I never said that at all. In fact I have a completely different view:
Those are YOUR projections into what YOU think that science and other
attitudes of mind are all about. Like your incomprehension of
scriptures, they are monumental and limited in the extreme.


Depends on whether you thought I would get to you first I guess. I
happen to realise that going around killing people is pretty much
guaranteed to get me killed. Seems a stupid thing to od.

Only a Chriustian Believer would fail to understand that at least, and I
am not so arrogant and Pious to imagine I could live comfortably without
the co-operation of a whole bunch of people ..I would be a fool to kill
them.

Geese and golden eggs springs to mind.


Actually, I don't have any of those things. I am not sure I would defend
any of my family against instant destruction ;-)

They are old enough to take care of themselves.



No I wouldn't. Cos by and large I don't love them all that much. I am
familiar with their ways, and they must make their own way.


You are in a muddle. You would worship gravity if you couldn't find
anything better.

My cat manages to 'love' its kittens without having to believe in
anything: Its just what cats do idiot.

Your great mistake is to think you are different.


Of course we all have an internalise bias towards looking after our kith
and kin: Any species that doesn't is an ex-species.

However turning that into what it isn't - some sort of universal guiding
*personalised* principal is totally unwarranted.

Its unwarranted extrapolation: you are a child, daddy takes care of you.
You grow up and still want someone to take care of you and set the
rules..so a smart Jew invented a daddy for you, sold it to you, and now
you feel relieved.

Smart jews have been selling the people what they want since forever. I
take my hat off to them. Even if the sales technique was a little
unorthodox in this case.



Ah. So every teenager with a hot crotch is just doing god's will eh?
Nice to know that. THEY all claim its love...

Its a nice story..keep on telling it to yourself.

It wasn't always that way though. God of teh old testament was one tough
merciless bastard.




Oh? well you can claim that there would be no computing without Bill
Gates I suppose. In fact you can make any amount of idiotic assertions
that are illogical and have no foundation in evidence..Why not. God is a
Unicorn. There are fairies at the bottom of my garden. Go on. Prove it
ain't so.



I haven't noticed many death throes just now.

Your mythology is extraordinary. You invent relationships between
enitities that are simply not there, and then contstruct a pseudo
philosophy based not on facts, but on your interpretiun of facts.


Look, its very simple. Nothing in this world or any other is known for
sure. There is no one single irrefutable FACT in existence. Not ebven
tey fact of our own existence, though that is as close as it gets to one.

Now I simply choose to make that my starting point. I exist. The rest os
all a phantasm of invention of entities that place 'me' in a more or
less comprehensible 'world'.

I choose to keep that phanatsm to the minimum necessary to achieve
continued life, and functionality.

I do not choose to place some arbitrary point called 'God' or the
'Bible' at the center of some extraordinarily complicated phantasm of
supernatural powers that causes things to be. Causality is a human
invention. Just another phantasm. Things are, mostly. Caasality is just
a way off expressing the interrelation between some of them. As is time
and space. These are man made artefacts that we use to navigate our way
around what we conceive the world to be. It may well be utterly
different: we can't ever know for sure.

Some of us learn to live with that uncertainty though. We do not need
the certainties that YOUR religion brings,. not its comforts and
promises. We have, if you like, exchanged the comfort of belief, for a
slightly clearer glimpse of Truth...


WWell it aint. It means nothing. You shouldn't use your intelligence
without learning the rules of rational thought.

You are a complete adept at self deception.


Yup. The love your momma gave you when you were 2 days old. Without
knowing why she did it. Or caring. She just did it. That memory lives
on..examine it: come to terms with it, and move on.

Its just an image of the sexual reproductive process. That's all. No
need to place it on a pedestal and worship it, or linger over it. Its
there. we feel tstrtoingly miotiovated, we shag, babaies come, we feel
compelled to care for them. Period. Thats teh way it works. Thats not
'God' thats 'nature'.

If its anything at all that needs a name given to it. Its just what
happens, is all.

Well so say you, and all those who want to crawl back to the womb..sadly
I don't think it works like that..


Ah..so thats your hell is it? emotional self torture?

In which case I have already passed through it, and learnt to deal with
it. *I* thought it was called 'growing up' ;-)

My hell would be to be deprived of any stimulation whatsoever, in some
pappy smothering coddling lurve, that sounds more like a bad case of
heroin addiction than heaven.




Don;t have one. Got two sisters. They are Ok. I guess. Wouldn't choose
em as friends, but I can tolerate their idiocies if I have to.


Friends. Yes . I care about my friends quite a bit. Thats me.

That's what you believe. My most hellish moments consist in loving
people who pissed all over me. So frankly absence of 'Lurve' in hell
would be rather comfortable for me.


I don't have a problem with no Lurve at all. I could sit there
discussing philosophy with Satan, and cheating at cards. Copuld be wuite
a lot of fun.

But of course there are an infinite number of heavens and hells. My life
consists in deciding what my personal heaven is and trying to create it.
And learning how to avoid my personal hells. However I am not stupid and
arrogant enough to assume that everyone else has the same nature aswme,.
or the same interpretation as to what it all means.


Look, if you take emotion out, I won't care one way or the other. I
don't do fear any more either. Nothing makes me thgat way. I get a
fright now and again, bu fear is clinging on to stuff. let go and accept
the inevitable - even the pain and suffering of growing old. *shrug* its
the way it is ..that's all.

You are, I'm trying hard not to. It doesn't feature in my world a huge
amount. And dare I say it, its better off without..

He didn;t live in isolation and lonelines: by all accounts he had a
perfectly normal childhood and lots of fun, and learnt a trade before
wandering off to become a shaman-prophet and learning all the curious
stuff that he tried to express in rather simple terms to a bunch of even
simpler folk speaking a very limited language.


And got himself nailed to a cross for his pains, and then had peter
bugger the whole thing around and turn it into a Roman political weapon.
Bit like the way Stalin took the words of Karl Marx.

For heavens sake, study the esoteric Jewish writings - the Torah and the
Kabballah etc..and see where it all comes from. Then toss in a bit of
Hinduism and shamanism, even Sufism, and have a long hard look at
Buddhism, and Western philosophy, and GROW UP. You haven't even got to
first base in the spiritual game: its a whole lot MORE weird and
complicated and mysterious than you think.

I think the best definition of Christainity was made in two words by an
old Jewess I used to know.

"Child psychology"

Or because He was a misguided idiot. Whose political message if spun a
little was VERY useful to an Empire looking to pacify a bunch of
Northern barbarians without it costing too much.

to be right in the first place.just functional effective aware and adult.

Right and Wrong, like Lurve, is just something I grew out of. There are
simply decisions that affect me. and others, and therefore indirectly
me, since I live in a society of more than myself. Try learning to stand
on your own two feet, and cast aside your crutches...its terribly hard,
but you will improve with practice.

tony h wrote:
depth, particularly the esoteric side of them - they all contain a
common philosophical core that goes right back to the dawn of time when
the shaman priests first started trying to explain the world..

But the real thing is , he doesn't want to. he feels warm cosy and safe
with his beliefs, he has - as the song says - 'exchanged a walk on part
in the war, for a lead role in a cage..'

He isn't interested in Truth,. That much is clear. He wants a simple
comfortable EXPLANATION that makes him feel safe, and superior, and
righteous. And tells him wahgt to do so he won't HAVE to think for
himself, or struggle with difficult decisions.

And guess what, some Roman had one all ready shrink wrapped, tailored to
the North West European mindset, and he's bought it hook, line *and* sinker.

*shrug* 'Give da peepul vot dey vant'


Why do you think there is this rise of fundamental religion sweeping the
world? because they are shit scared, that their cosy beliefs are going
to be stripped away, and they will have to stand naked in the harsh
light of Reality.

WE don't go spamming net groups proselytising about Atheism, or
Agnosticism. We occasionally respond to THEIR shit.

Look at his post: Its classic FUD. Fear of bad stuff 'hell' and the
promise that the product (God) will instantly give you a solution to all
life's problems. Backed up by a bunch of pseudo logical claptrap. "Red
Bull gives you wings". "Colgate, *for people who don't have time to
brush after every meal*:". who did? but who dared admit that they
didn't? eh? He's little better than a smack peddler.


Do you want to be a good person? Who's gonna say 'No: I wanna be BAD!'.
Or better still, 'Bad and good are relative and subjective terms, so the
question is outside of a personal interpretation, meaningless'

I used to have convesratins with a racist whirte supremacist ONB who
would preface his conversations with 'Look: you have to admit that these
slit-eyes and niggers are different'

To which I simply said 'No, I don't admit that at all, at a fundamental
level'. That stopped the conversation dead.

Then there was the extraordinary claim that "they don't have souls, you
know".

Scratch a devout Christian of that ilk, and you find some very nasty
stuff inside.

"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
news:1198068819.51333.0@despina.uk.clara.net...

very true, my misspent youth was a long time ago, i sort of assumed that
anyone with a firm belief system would have, as i did, check out many of the
alternatives to see why my system was better than theirs, and in what ways
was theirs wrong, by doing this i found that mine was also wrong (ex
catholic, protestant, jehovahs witness). looked into buddhism, sikism,
islam, south american mysicism, uk mystisism and various others as i've come
acrss them. through study on various levels each belief has, to me, been
disproved to a reasonable degree of certainy.
one of the things modern believers forget is that religion itself evolves,
at one time it was perfectly normal to believe in and worship dozens of
different gods, as we learn more about the world we need less of them, we
now know that the sun will come up in the morning, we don't have to
sacrifice to it or have a god-king to make it happen. all that i, and
others like me, have done is take this regression to its natural conclusion,
from dozens of gods, to one, to none.
i do understand that people 'know what they know' but this doesnt make it
true, my brother (honestly!) works in a mental hospital where there is 1
mohammed, 2 jesus's and various others, each is positive about his identity,
but they cannot all be right, but if they had the charisma to convince
others...

"national treasure" <laughing@thefrogs.com> wrote in message
news:5sr8tbF1a5e38U1@mid.individual.net...
So - were I to accept that protestant christianity might be the brand for
me, which flavour would be the best?
Which would be your recommended "best buy" out of, say, the church of
england, the church in wales, the church of scotland, the church of ireland,
methodists, baptists, moravians, lutherans, dutch reformed, united reformed,
presbyterians (free or otherwise), etc.?
Or do you belong to a denomination not mentioned above? If so, which one?
In any case, how does your chosen denomination outshine the others? What's
it's USP?
I do like to do carry out a bit of market research before deciding on things
and the choice here is bewildering.

George