In previously looking at options for adding an external audio device to a
notebook computer, all that I considered were USB devices. There are also a
couple of Firewire devices on the market, but at a high price.

I had read a good review of the Echo Indigo PCMCIA card interface, but
dropped that from consideration when I realized that it only provides output
from the PC, not input into it. Actually, my laptop sound card has a fairly
good output, but no stereo analog in at all (only a mono external microphone
port), so the input capability is more important to me.

Well, I just found out that Echo has just come out with a new version of the
Indigo, which includes input as well as output. The URL for that unit is:

http://www.echoaudio.com/Products/IndigoIO/index.php

Has anyone reading actually tried one of these devices yet? I'm not sure if
they are actually available for purchase yet, or just being advertised in
advance by the manufacturer.

Anyone have an idea of how much these will sell for? I assume more than the
output-only device, but since I believe that is quite reasonable, this new
version might also be in the lower cost end of external audio devices.

How does the speed of a PCMCIA interface compare with USB? I know that USB
2.0 and Firewire are supposed to be much faster than USB 1.1, but as of this
point only a few expensive models are available with those interfaces. How
does the speed of the PCMCIA bus compare with USB 1 and 2, Firewire?

Any feedback would be appreciated. Thank you.

In comp.sys.laptops MS <ms@nospam.com> wrote:
Irrelevant.
If you'r looking for line in, all it has to be is faster than the
output stream from the ADC, typically 150K/s.
You should be able to do at least 3 CD quality streams on a USB 1.1 port.
USB 2 hundreds and Cardbus should be able to do thousands.

Then again, on the "neat gadget" front, the really high end MP3 players
can do this too.
I was looking on ebay, and if it wasn't 10 times my budget for an MP3
player I'd have gone with an one of the IRiver devices.
Around the same size as a C cell, neat shape, line in, 512M MP3 playback/record
and a FM radio too.

(if later input to the PC would do, I don't know if they can stream)

--
http://inquisitor.i.am/ | mailto:inquisitor@i.am | Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Things a surgeon should never say:
Better save that for the autopsy.

"Ian Stirling" <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bdf2cn$7hi$1$830fa7b3@news.demon.co.uk...
..
So, PC Card is much faster than USB 2? I didn't know that.

Why then, have there been fewer and fewer PC card peripherals in recent
years, superseded by USB (1.1) peripherals?

MS wrote:
Easily verified and absolutely correct.

The false assumption is that this is the case. USB 1.1 is good
only for low end slow speed peripherals...a rather large set of
them. USB 2, FireWire, Infiniband, FiberChannel are still
used for higher transfer rates.

"Lon Stowell" <lon.stowell@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:3EFB2440.7020303@attbi.com...

Yes, of course USB 2 and Firewire are much faster than USB 1.1. (I haven't
even heard of the 3rd and 4th protocols you mention.) USB 2 just came out,
so not many peripherals for it yet. I assume that within a few years, it
will have completely superseded USB 1.1 (while retaining backward
compatibility). Not so many people have Firewire, and the other two you
mention must be pretty rare.

PCMCIA, on the other hand, exists on practically all notebook computers, and
was present long before any kind of USB. Most external devices for notebooks
used to be PCMCIA, and now most seem to be USB (at this point, still much
more 1.1 than 2). Therefore, I'm surprised to read that PCMCIA is much
faster than USB, even faster than USB 2, as it's a much older protocol, for
which there are fewer peripherals available these days.

MS wrote:
CardBus is not PC Card. PC Card is very slow like ISA bus. CardBus is
fast like PCI bus, around 1 gigabit/second. They use the same pins and
look similar. CardBus cards won't fit in a PC Card socket but PC Cards
will fit in a CardBus socket since the newer bridge actually has two
separate bridges, one PC Card to ISA and one CardBus to PCI -- it uses
the appropriate one.

MS wrote:
Ahh, if you'll forgive the expression, Apples and Oranges.
PCMCIA and Cardbus are parallel technologies that work very
nicely for stuffing cards in a backpanel. As is VME, ISA, EISA,
PCI, PCI-2, S-BUS etc. What these bus types all shine at is
interfacing stuff to the parallel data bus found inside the
computer. They also can run very fast, and with semismart
technology on the plugin card with good DMA technology
they can not only run fast, but place a fairly light load
on the system processor. These cards have that parallel bus
on one side, and then some sort of device and/or network
attach on the other. It is trivial to get transfer rates of
160 Mbytes per second with a PCI bus type card, say with a
SCSI on the "outbound" side, with 320 Mbytes/second not being
that uncommon.

What these bus technologies all stink at is physical distance,
where the USB shines. However, this is where the apples and
oranges come into play. There is only one way to get USB
connect on a PC. You either put a USB controller chip on the
computer I/O bus on the motherboard or you put the USB
controller on a plugin card... such as PCI, PCMCIA, etc.
Since nobody makes USB controllers that really interface well
with the higher speed motherboard bus, it should be no
surprise that the motherboard USB interconnects will not
be as high performance or light processor load as a PCI
plugin type that has a bit of microengine on it.
However, the USB 1.1 itself is rather lethargic as a
technology. Faster than a printer port, but nowhere near
SCSI. BUT it is fast enough for most purposes...and cheap...and
flexible...and can be attached to devices some distance from
the computer...and to an expansion hub. This makes it a
better answer to interconnect as long as the speed is not
an issue.

In comp.sys.laptops Dave Perks <Dave_Perks@mitel.com> wrote:
IIRC, PCMCIA maxes out at around 4-5 megabytes/second, a little faster
than ISA.

Cardbus is a similar connector, that's somewhat a cut-down PCI bus, I think
the maximum for large bursts is 32 bits * 33Mhz, or about 233 megabytes/
second, the same as PCI.

--
http://inquisitor.i.am/ | mailto:inquisitor@i.am | Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Two fish in a tank: one says to the other, "you know how to drive this thing??"

I do professional level audio mixing. I've a long-standing loyalty to
Creative Labs, simply because everyone supports their sound cards. I'm
currently using a Creative Exitgy (for about a year and a half now) and have
no complaints about it. I'm going to move to Sony's new high end GTR laptop
and the new MP3 card looked like a good option to replace the Exitgy
(although I could just use that as it also interfaces over a USB) .

Preliminary testing with the MP3+ shows that it is a very capable soundcard
and I expect a good result.

The Echo PCM card you cited earlier also looks interesting, but it doesn't
appear to be a soundcard. It looks more like a port replicator that
explicitly adds Line In and Line Out feeds. There is a value in this, but
the quality of the sound you end up with is determined more by the card that
is producing the sound than by the nature of the feeds. So using the Echo
card makes it easier to use whatever soundcard your laptop has, but the
quality of the finished product will be determined by the nature of that
soundcard. The Creative Labs product replaces the soundcard in your laptop
and gives you standard Creative Labs quality sound. Therefore, the end
result will likely be better.

Scot

If your Extigy still works, and you have no complaints about it, why replace
it with the MP3+, which is a lower-end product than the Extigy? (Except if
it's for the convenience of not having to plug it into AC.)

I'm not sure why you consider the Echo Indigo I/O not to be a soundcard. Did
you look at the web page I cited? It looks like a sound card to me.

"Rev. Dr. C. Scot Giles" <CSGiles@uuma.org> wrote in message
news:L7OKa.1217$Va5.372629@dca1-nnrp1.news.algx.net...

The Extigy will travel with the present computer to my wife's office when
the Sony notebook arrives. I'm trying to minimize the number of components
that require AC in my office to deal with the heat buildup (I also use
mixing consoles, Tascam CD burners and bulk duplicators, etc.) in the room.
So the idea of something that does not need to be plugged in is attractive.
That's part of why I'm moving to a computer with a lower voltage chip and
less heat output. The current Gateway machine is like having a space heater
in the office.

I only glanced at the Echo card and didn't notice anything the indicates
it's a soundcard, but didn't really look carefully. If I can stay with
Creative Labs products I'll do that simply because all sound editing
software works with them readily.

Scot




" MS" <ms@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1056688092.595054@news-1.nethere.net...

"Rev. Dr. C. Scot Giles" <CSGiles@uuma.org> wrote in message
news:6wWKa.1282$Va5.389115@dca1-nnrp1.news.algx.net...
Well, Creative Labs must like you--real brand-name loyalty. (The products
are probably made in different factories in China, and stamped with the CL
name.)

Actually, I would think that any Windows sound-editing software should work
with any Windows-compatible sound card.