Good God--I just attempted to install Windows NT4, (for a client) and
what a piece of crap!!
Couldn't recognize hardware, cumbersome install, very, very, slow,
etc.
I abandoned the install prior to completion and went with RH9 instead.

But I guess you guys knew this.
The client demanded NT because he had heard of it, and all his
associates used it.
I convinced him that email, webserver, and file server duties were
adequately addressed by Linux, more robust, and (ahem) free. He's OK
for now, but waiting for something to happen to prove me wrong.

Having never really administered NT, I just gotta know:

Are there ANY advantages to NT over Linux?
Just what is the attraction?
Surely, there's something, but what????

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 21:46:48 -0600, Jeff wrote:

NT4 is rather old by now. A fairer comparison would be RH9 versus
a more recent Windows (XP Pro, or maybe 2K Pro; the former irks me,
solely on user interface issues) or NT4 versus an older Linux.

Jeff wrote:

2 things:

1) familiarity.
Most people use Windows on the desktop, and as a result, they generally
are more comfortable with it when learning to administer a server.

2) The cd makes a great coaster.

Jeff <s@t> wrote:
NT4 is considered "dead" by Microsoft and no longer supported, you should
persuade your client to switch to something more up-to-date.

Davide

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 21:46:48 -0600, Jeff wrote:

[Snip]

Well, you do use an UPS, RAID 1 or 5 and backup now and again, don't you?
(I'd also use "bonding" 2 NICs to 2 switches, and serial-consoles, BTW.)

But better, use 2 boxen and setup `hardbeat':
http://www.linux-ha.org/

Lucky you.

Some applications will only run on it. So, in that case you'd need to run
it in Bochs for them to work.

The GUI looks like win95, and m$ pussed that down peoples troughs.
(So, it looks to them (managers) as though, they don't need any competent
personel to administrate it.)

Familiarity with it's interfaces.

--
-Menno.

Jeff wrote (in part):

Well, if you are a shareholder of Microsoft Corporation (MSFT) ...

--
.~. Jean-David Beyer Registered Linux User 85642.
/V\ Registered Machine 73926.
/( )\ Shrewsbury, New Jersey http://counter.li.org
^^-^^ 8:40am up 33 days, 7:14, 2 users, load average: 2.30, 2.37, 2.24

Ori wrote (in part):

middle.


--
.~. Jean-David Beyer Registered Linux User 85642.
/V\ Registered Machine 73926.
/( )\ Shrewsbury, New Jersey http://counter.li.org
^^-^^ 8:40am up 33 days, 7:14, 2 users, load average: 2.30, 2.37, 2.24

Jean-David Beyer wrote:

CD+Blu tak + micro wave, place blu tak in center of microwave turn table,
place CD vertical in blu tak, turn on full power for 3-5 seconds.

Please refer to :- http://hamjudo.com/notes/cdrom.html

great visual display but not recommended if you need to use the micro wave for
food afterwards ( leaves a nasty after taste

Ps. don`t try this at home kids please, posted in jest.


--
Mark
Twixt hill and high water.
N.Wales, UK.
Email is spam trap try baskitcaise at gmx dot co dot uk

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 21:46:48 -0600, Jeff <s@t> wrote:

.... BSDs ?
.... it's all marketing
..
--
/// Michael J. Tobler: motorcyclist, surfer, skydiver, \\\
\\\ and author: "Inside Linux", "C++ HowTo", "C++ Unleashed" ///
Make it myself? But I'm a physical organic chemist!

On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 14:34:19 +0000, baskitcaise <baskitcaise@hotmail.com> wrote:

.... reminds me: once at the office, i put a bag of popcorn
in the microwave and accidentally set the time to 30 minutes,
versus 3 minutes. after about 5 minutes, someone detected the
smell (i was on the phone) and went to turn the micro off.

the bag exploded burnt popcorn and butter all over the
inside of the micro. we had to open all the doors up and
turn a fan on for the rest of the day - the smell lingered
for a day or so
..
--
/// Michael J. Tobler: motorcyclist, surfer, skydiver, \\\
\\\ and author: "Inside Linux", "C++ HowTo", "C++ Unleashed" ///
My theology, briefly, is that the universe was dictated
but not signed. - Christopher Morley

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 21:46:48 -0600, Jeff <s@t> wrote in
comp.os.linux.misc:

Win2k is a far better OS than NT. Microsoft doesn't even support NT 4
anymore.

Menno Duursma <menno@desktop.lan> wrote in
newsan.2003.11.27.12.30.15.71839@desktop.lan:

That is exactly the point. I started at a company never having sat in front
of an NT machine and then administered NT with very few problems. I would
put this down to a Windows 98 background and a fair amount of intuition.

I am having to *learn* linux, but once learned, it has big advantages.

Cheers
Tim

Jeff> But I guess you guys knew this. The client demanded NT
Jeff> because he had heard of it, and all his associates used it.
Jeff> I convinced him that email, webserver, and file server
Jeff> duties were adequately addressed by Linux, more robust, and
Jeff> (ahem) free. He's OK for now, but waiting for something to
Jeff> happen to prove me wrong.

Jeff> Having never really administered NT, I just gotta know:

Jeff> Are there ANY advantages to NT over Linux?

Yes. The client believes that he has someone (M$) to blame and sue
when things go wrong (when in fact this is not the case).


Jeff> Just what is the attraction?

Brand name. Most people still believe that M$ is the greatest s/w
company of the world. And based on this false assumption, they
believe that any software products from M$ must be the best.


Jeff> Surely, there's something, but what????

Ignorance. And FUD for a change.


--
Lee Sau Dan +Z05biGVm-(Big5) ~{@nJX6X~}(HZ)

E-mail: danlee@informatik.uni-freiburg.de
Home page: http://www.informatik.uni-freiburg.de/~danlee

Jeff <s@t> wrote in message news:<evqasvss5o330mcrqbl1j5evu3e7nsdhja@4ax.com>. ..
Yup. Erm. Oh.. there must be one... Oh yeah, sometimes you *have* to
use it because your boss says so. Hm. Thats not really an advantage,
is it? Erm.. Ok, how about the later versions of the software (like
Windows 2000) are 'based on NT technology', so when you upgrade from
NT some of your programs will continue to work. No, thats no good
either. Yes!! I have one!! It teaches you the importance of having to
apply service packs to M$ software (over and over again, and in the
case of NT the >same one< over and over...)

On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 15:53:55 GMT, John Hanson
<jhanson@northernlinks.com> wrote:

And they "Support" anything??? News to me.

Mike-

Mornings: Evolution in action. Only the grumpy will survive.
-----------------------------------------------------

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OK.
Is there anything NT, in all it flavors. can do that Linux can't???
Not trolling, just honestly asking.



On Fri, 28 Nov 2003 10:29:59 -1000, Angela Kahealani
<angela@kahealani.com> wrote:

Albert <F@T>,
In a message on Fri, 28 Nov 2003 17:53:18 -0600, wrote :

A> OK.
A> Is there anything NT, in all it flavors. can do that Linux can't???
A> Not trolling, just honestly asking.

BSOD

Run MS-Office as a native application.

Run Internet Explorer and/or Outlook Express as native applications.

Run the Blaster worm.

Make money for Microsoft.

A>
A>
A>
A> On Fri, 28 Nov 2003 10:29:59 -1000, Angela Kahealani
A> <angela@kahealani.com> wrote:
A>
A> >> Is there ANY value to NT???
A> >
A> >Not in this newsgroup.
A>
A>

\/
Robert Heller ||InterNet: heller@cs.umass.edu
http://vis-www.cs.umass.edu/~heller || heller@deepsoft.com
http://www.deepsoft.com /\FidoNet: 1:321/153

Centuries ago, Nostradamus foresaw when Albert <F@T> would write:
Well, it's generally a lot better as a platform for Microsoft Windows
applications. But that is more or less a truism.

Windows NT has, from its Prism/VMS roots, a security model that more
strongly resembles VMS than Unix, and if you are trying to put
together a really fine-grained security configuration, Windows NT is
therefore probably preferable.

But beyond that, they're all fairly sophisticated multitasking,
multi-user operating systems, running atop Turing machines, and thus
so long as they have sufficiently powerful languages to control them,
they are of roughly equivalent conceptual power.

There may be specific computer software that runs on one OS and not
the other; there's no good "honest" difference.
--
wm(X,Y):-write(X),write('@'),write(Y). wm('cbbrowne','ntlug.org').
http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/lsf.html
Rules of the Evil Overlord #18. "I will not have a son. Although his
laughably under-planned attempt to usurp power would easily fail, it
would provide a fatal distraction at a crucial point in time."
<http://www.eviloverlord.com/>

Albert <F@T> writes:

Why certainly, Windows NT provides a revenue stream to the Microsoft and its
shareholders that Linux does not. NT runs software written for (imagine this!)
NT which Linux (thankfully) will not do.

David

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 09:20:05 GMT, david emile lamy wrote:

=>Albert <F@T> writes:
=>
=>> OK.
=>> Is there anything NT, in all it flavors. can do that Linux can't???
=>> Not trolling, just honestly asking.
=>>
=>>
=>>
=>> On Fri, 28 Nov 2003 10:29:59 -1000, Angela Kahealani
=>> <angela@kahealani.com> wrote:
=>>
=>> >> Is there ANY value to NT???
=>> >
=>> >Not in this newsgroup.
=>
=>Why certainly, Windows NT provides a revenue stream to the Microsoft and its
=>shareholders that Linux does not. NT runs software written for (imagine this!)
=>NT which Linux (thankfully) will not do.
=>
=>David

Now that you've read the snide remarks, here's less biased
opinion:

WinNT is the predecessor of Win2000 and WinXP. Of the
three, WinXP Pro is IMO the only OS worth considering as a
new installation. If you buy one of those boxes with WinXP
Home bundled in, pay a little extra and get the Pro edition
instead. It's the most stable and fastest version of this
family of OSs.

However, WinXP suffers from all, the MS OS flaws: It is
less stable than its competitors, but if you stick to plain
vanilla applications you will probably not have much
trouble with it. It's horribly bloated, which means you
need a fast CPU and lots of RAM to get decent performance
out of it. It is vulnerable to virus attacks, which means
you must get 3rd party firewalls, browsers, etc to make it
useable as a 'net machine. Its installed defaults are
stoopid, and therefore it requires a fair bit of
customisation before it's usable. WinNT4 is supposedly a
fairly good server platform, I'm told. The latest version
of XP Pro is supposed to live quite peaceably with OS/2 and
Linux, however.

OTOH, my Win2000 box runs Microsoft's' Train Simulator just
beautifully. :-) It's pretty fair game machine, if you're
into games. And some easy-to-use multimedia apps (eg video
editing) are available only in Windows XP versions -- but
if you want a serious multimedia machine, you're probably
better off getting a Mac anyhow.

Would I buy XP? Not as a new install. But since it comes on
almost every cheap box you can buy these days, I wouldn't
turn it down; I just wouldn't use it much.

HTH

--
Wolf Kirchmeir
If you didn't want to go to Chicago, why did you get on the train?
(Garrison Keillor)
<just one w and plain ca for correct e-mail address>