This is a bit of a different question than the normal ones you see in
this forum. I have an apartment complex I want to cheaply wire every
room for internet. I want to use existing infrastructure so the only
choices I have are phone, electric, wireless, or cable. Right now I'm
investigating cable and it seems like all CMTS transmitters are
$10,000+. Could I possibly use a regular cable modem combined with a
semi-sophisticated router to send the signal and then cable modems in
each room to recieve?

Thanks.

On Fri, 26 Nov 2004 19:52:33 -0800, Jim Bohan wrote:

Cable modems to receive what? Wouldn't it be better for the cable company
to wire each apartment for internet cable (as well as TV)? Make your life
much easier.

--
-- James Fenimore Cooper
The tendency of democracies is, in all things, to mediocrity, since the tastes,
knowledge, and principles of the majority form the tribunal of appeal.

Jim Bohan wrote:

No. The cable modems that subscribers get, transmit below about 40 MHz and
receive near 800 MHz, so there's no way to get one to talk to another. If
you have two spare phone pairs running to each unit, you could use 10baseT
ethernet, provided the building was wired with CAT3 cable.

Perhaps the least expensive, and actually rather effective way would be
to place a few switches in the phone wiring closet (enough for 1 port
per apartment) and, as James suggested, utilize the green & brown pairs
of the phone cable to each apartment for ethernet. If the outlets are
homerun to a location in the apartment, splice the green & brown pairs
of the cable from the main closet with the cable for the outlet you're
going to use for your ethernet. If the outlets are daisy-chained,
splice those pairs from the first outlet all the way through to where
you'll have your jack. Then bring in either a T1 or a 1.5Mbps DSL
connection.

You could utilize the caox only if you have a private cable system --
one that is owned (headend and all) by the apartment complex and has
nothing at all to do with the local franchise cable company. The
downstream for cable modems is wherever you decided to locate it, from
88-860MHz. One of the engineers here wanted to place cable modems at
117MHz, but lost out to 519MHz. The upstream can be pretty much
anywhere from 15-42MHz. The return path is 5-42MHz, but most digital
cable boxes (DCTs) use ~11-13MHz. If you're a part of the local
franchise system, you're SOL for a cable modem solution. If the system
is yours and you do want to go that route, let me know. You can get a
good CMTS for smaller applications such as yours for ~7k or so.


CIAO!

Ed Nielsen
CENCOM
www.cencom94.com

Jim Bohan wrote:

Ed Nielsen wrote:
I don't think the tenants who have two phone lines would appreciate
something like this.

--
Warren H.

==========
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Any resemblance to the views of anybody living or dead is
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Warren wrote:
The tenants probably won't appreciate being hijacked out of their
existing internet, either.

Q

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 15:39:49 -0700, Quaoar wrote:

Maybe. I'd be more concerned by RFI, amongst other things. Phone wire
wasn't meant to be used as Ethernet. Plus let's not forget he did mention
wireless. So there's a possability there.

--
-- James Fenimore Cooper
The tendency of democracies is, in all things, to mediocrity, since the tastes,
knowledge, and principles of the majority form the tribunal of appeal.

BR <brodriguez@comcast.net> wrote:
Try VDSL. It works over the phone copper and does not prevent normal phone
service over the same line. Plus last I checked the VDSL modems were quite
cheap (though the CO-part might cost somewhere in the range of $1000).
Still way cheaper than becoming a small time Cable-ISP. Speed depending on
line quality up to 25mbps in the downstream.

CU

René

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There has never been a cabling related issue.

I certainly don't like running data and voice on the same cable, either,
but when a house or apartment building is built with only 1 cable to
each outlet, what ya gonna do? I inherited some townhouses and some
apartments that were cabled like that (the apartments were daisy-chained
with 1 CAT3, and the townhouses were homerun with 1 CAT5 per outlet At
least there are 2 CAT5s going in from outside).

No complaints of degradation in phone service or reduced internet
performance at all.


CIAO!

Ed Nielsen
CENCOM
www.cencom94.com

Warren wrote:

BR wrote:

????

10baseT ethernet was designed to work over existing cat3 phone cable.

How would anyone be hijacked out of their existing internet? Using
pairs 3 & 4 for ethernet for a high speed internet network still leaves
pairs 1 & 2 for phone service, so they could still have their dial-up if
they prefer. If someone had 2 voice lines and a third for internet and
wanted to stay with 56k rather than go with 900k+, just don't connect
that apartment.


CIAO!

Ed

Quaoar wrote:

Ed Nielsen wrote:
Apartment owners love to install proprietary cable television as a
supplied service, picking up in the process an additional fee from the
tenants who, if they want cable television, must contract with the owner
for it. The same can be said for internet access; all it takes is a
clause in the lease. It has nothing to do with technology; it's all
about the money.

Q

Yes, apartment owners do love to install their own, private CATV systems
in lieu of the local franchise system. Sometimes it's owned, operated,
and maintained by the property. Sometimes it's owned by the property
and maintained by a private contractor. Sometimes, it's owned,
operated, and maintained by a private contractor. Sometimes, the
service is included in the rent and sometimes the tenent must subscribe.
Many install a distributed satellite system and offer a basic package
to their tenants. If they want to upgrade their package, they can.
Regardless of the type of system for delivery of video content any given
property has, the residents are stuck with it. Their only alternative
is to put up their own dish.

Many also have their own switch and provide phone service to their
tenants, as many have their own network for internet access. Sure, the
owners would rather the tenants use their network (usually a better
service at similar or better pricing than dial-up, and, like you said,
the owners get a piece of that), but there's no clause in any lease that
could say that a tenent couldn't subscribe to a dial-up service provider
if they wanted to. How can a property tell a resident who they can and
cannot call on the telephone?


CIAO!

Ed

Quaoar wrote:

Ed Nielsen wrote:
Absolutely correct. The OP was about cable interent, however.

Q

Ed Nielsen wrote:

One problem with some apartment phone systems, is that they're also used for
door intercom & buzzer, which tends to clobber phone modem data.