After many years with my trusty Abit Bh6 motherboard I decided to upgrade
to a new system. The Abit started life with a Celeron 300a,
overclocked perfectly to 450mhz from day one and then upgraded about a
year and a half ago via a PowerLeap Slotkit to a 1.2GHz Pentium.
This has been without question the most stable system I have ever seen or
owned and now it will be serving mp3's etc for flatfish central as soon as
I figure out how to do it

I am an Intel person because the chips are superior and in my experience
they simply outperform the AMD chips for stability and integration with
popular DAW software.

Also I know of no major player in the Professional DAW world that is
building and selling DAW systems built on the AMD platform.

For an example look here:

http://www.carillondirect.com/clnweb...jsp?country=UK

I am not saying that AMD isn't good, I am simply stating that for my needs
Intel is a better, although more expensive choice.

After much research and even more soul searching I settled on an Asus
P4P800 Deluxe:

http://usa.asus.com/products/mb/sock...d/overview.HTM

Intel P4 2.6ghz with Hyperthreading

1GB of Kingston KVR400x64C3AK2/1G PC3200 matched memory sticks.

A hefty Antec power supply:

http://www.antec-inc.com/pro_details...p?ProdID=20550

All components purchased from www.newegg.com

So anyway I assemble the beast (nothing but a video card to start) and hit
the power on switch and I get NOTHING! NADA! No beep, no squeak, just the
fans turning and the green led on the motherboard and my monitor still in
suspend with the yellow led on. I check everything twice and it all looks
fine.

Hmmmm... I have seen this one before and it's one of two things:

A) CMOS jumper set to reset (or CMOS NEEDS to be reset)

or

B) the beast is defective out of the box.

A quick call to Asus confirms that I should remove the battery, short out
CMOS and try again.

YEssssssssssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!

It runs POST and I am on my way toward adding in the hard drives and so
forth......

Since I was planning on reorganizing my system I decide on a scratch
install with Windows XP for my DAW work, although still connected to the
internet and including basic stuff, and SuSE 9.0 Linux for most other
stuff.

Let's start with the Windows Install first:

(All Western Digital drives are 7200rpm 8 meg cache and 120G/40G models
and have been set up with the WD Lifeline software to be Fat32 and free
space for Linux installation on the last drive on IDE2.

1. Install Windows XP which on this system takes about 45 minutes total.

2. Ethernet/USB/Firewire don't work. Hmm maybe this CDROM included with
the motherboard has something. I discover that the drivers are located on
the CDROM (along with a 3com Gigbit driver for Linux as well! Not needed
for SuSE 9.0 though) So I boot the CD and install what I think I need, but
reading the readme and known problems with the auto-install process leaves
me wondering. However, everything seems to work now, but I am still not
sure what drivers I am actually using and if they are the latest.

3. Start downloading all of the updates, more confusion as cumulative
service packs seem to superceed others yet they are all listed as being
critical which is confusing to me.

Oh well, I select everything and hope that MS can sort it all out which is
another hour or so and many reboots later as some packs can only be
installed by themselves.

So now everything is updated and it is time to install my applications.
Or maybe I should have installed the applications first and then updated?

Who the hell knows.

I spend hours installing all my DAW applications and discover that Nero,
which is legal and came with my TDK CDRW drive won't work with my new Sony
drive (hello Gary H!!) GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!
Where does it say on the outside of the box that Nero only works with THAT
CDROM?

Long story is everything works fine, although I spent a day+ doing
it and I am sick of entering serial numbers and re-booting.

I really am.

I did a drive image of the virgin system so I don't have to go through
this again.

On to SuSE Linux:

I pop in the install CD and I am on my way but the install seems to be
taking longer than it generally does which is odd.
The install completes in about an hour and all my applications seem to be
ok but the system is very sluggish for some odd reason.

I have a knoppix CD and I boot that and it absoultley screams with speed
so something is not right with SuSE.

I did some benchmarks downloading a large file over my network (actually
the knoppix iso) and it is crawling and at the rate it is going it will
take 7 hours to transfer it!

Windows XP did the same transfer in 75 seconds.

I try www.dslreports.com for some tests and I am getting about 1/2 the
speed of Windows XP on transfers and it is repeatable.

At first I suspected the 3com Gigabit ethernet controller driver because
it is pretty new hardware but I couldn't seem to find anyone having any
major troubles with it, at least not recently.

I posted to the SuSE group, but the usual clowns over there descended upon
me like the Waffen SS and had nothing but insults to offer as well as "I
know the fix, but I won't tell you" comments. See a thread around 10/31
to see how little that person actually knows.

So, anyhow off I go to the SuSE Database, which has to have the worst
search engine on earth next to IBM and Microsoft, looking for information
is a crapshoot and why I can't hit the back button and keep my arguments
the same is a mystery to me. I stumble upon Hyperthreading at just
about the same time as a person named Allen C sends me instructions for
fixing the problem after he read my post.

It seems that the stock SuSE SMP kernel has some problems.

Just for kicks I installed the stock non-SMP kernel(k_deflt) to see
what would happen and like magic the system was screaming the way it
should have been in the first place.

Getting brave, I look at SuSE's update site and discover some new kernels
both SMP and standard.

I install the new SMP version and now the system is running the way it
should be.

flatfish@slappy:~> uname -a

Linux slappy 2.4.21-144-smp4G #1 SMP Fri Nov 14 00:07:01 UTC 2003 i686
i686 i386 GNU/Linux

top - 16:43:09 up 1:14, 4 users, load average: 0.35, 0.48,
Tasks: 86 total, 1 running, 85 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0
Cpu(s): 1.4% user, 1.9% system, 0.0% nice, 96.7% idle
Mem: 1031496k total, 491920k used, 539576k free, 5482
Swap: 1052248k total, 0k used, 1052248k free, 22260


*************Conclusions********************

Linux is years ahead of Windows in terms of installs, even for a basic
install.
Windows needed the drivers just for the motherboard chipset, yet Linux
installed them all right from the start.
In all fairness, maybe newer versions of XP have these drivers
slip-streamed in place, I don't know but it was still a pita.
Then I had to install all of my software and worst of all the pop-up
stoppers, spybot,Anti-virus software,firewall etc
I also had to secure the system with XPAnti-Spy.

Linux (SuSE) had the kernel problem that is true, but once I knew what the
problem was, it was easily fixable and I have not had any other problems.

This system is light years ahead of my other system in terms of speed and
seems to be stable under both operating systems.

I posted the hardware details because it is always nice to see what total
system components work with each other well based on others experience.

Linux is looking better by the day....

Enjoy!!

flatfish+++

flatfish+++ threw some tea leaves on the floor
and this is what they wrote:

Hi Flatty!

I left your post un-trimmed because I think it's an excellent review.

Even the fact that you went looking for another kernel demonstrates to
me how much you have changed your attitude about GNU/Linux the last
year or so.

Pete Goodwin would just slam GNU/Linux because the std kernel was slow,
and replace the Windows part of your post with "Windows works".

I can't wait for the day that your DAW stuff is supported by Linux


--
Kind Regards from Terry
My Desktop is powered by GNU/LinuX, Gentoo-1.4_rc2
New Homepage: http://milkstone.d2.net.au/
** Linux Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **

Fearing a spontaneous XP reboot, flatfish+++ mumbled this incantation:

First, I thank you myself for a straightforward account free of polemics
and gratuitious insults. I'm more convinced than ever that there
are/were two flatfishes out there.

Bad help sucks. I'm finding Google is a great backup for whatever help
system I need for what I'm working on at the moment.

There's an old adage that says that multi-threaded code developed on a
single processor will almost always be very broken the first time you
use it on a system with multiple processors.

The often rapid turnaround for fixes is a great feature of open source
and free software.

If you don't have a good OEM CD with XP drivers for your box, you're in
for a lot of trouble.

You truly are a different variety of flatfish.

--
No, I won't fix your Windows computer!

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:26:06 -0600, Linønutlinønut wrote:

Hmmmm.....
Maybe


Google is generally my first source for information as it is more
forgiving of obtuse search arguments than most website search engines are.


Could be.
Whatever the cause they seemed to have fixed it quick enough.
The Intel hyperthreading thingie is kind of an oddball thing anyway
because it really isn't 2 distinct CPU's but the OS is tricked into
thinking there are.

Looking at gkrellm I see subtle differences in the CPU graphs depending
upon what tasks I am doing so it *is* doing something.
In all honesty though I don't see much of a difference between the SMP
kernel and the standard kernel, but I am not loading the system that much
with applications that might take advantage of it.


I agree.
Looks like 2 weeks for a new kernel from the release date of SuSE 9.0.

There is only *one* variety of flatfish

flatfish+++

flatfish+++ wrote:

2003. So, on November 21, 2005, the flatfish will lose the label of
wintroll.

--
7:45pm up 41 days, 20:02, 1 user, load average: 1.05, 1.09, 1.07
To email me, change .com to .ca Linux Counter Registration #126647

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:52:22 -0700, Michael Vester wrote:

Na, I think that there are two things to Flats turn around. He is learning
more about Linux and Linux has improved greatly on the desktop over the
last year and a half.

Freeride wrote:

So, in other words, around january 5 he will restart his wintroll career
again
I don't believe for a second that he has changed.
--
Microsoft: The company that made email dangerous
*

Michael Vester threw some tea leaves on the floor
and this is what they wrote:

<deletia>
To my recollection Flatfish has had only very positive things to say
about GNU/Linux since sep03 ?


--
Kind Regards from Terry
My Desktop is powered by GNU/LinuX, Gentoo-1.4_rc2
New Homepage: http://milkstone.d2.net.au/
** Linux Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **

Terry wrote:

and then he restarted his troll stace in the course of 2 hours.
Meaning, it does not matter what he is poting now. Not a single bit.
I do *not* believe this thief and liar. This /might/ change after he posted
for some years without him falling back
--
Most projects start out slowly -- and then sort of taper off.
-- Norman Augustine

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 10:46:45 +0100, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

My take on this is that I've never seen him post anything other than
positive stuff on COLA, and found his reviews quite informative. But, I
have also done a google search on this character, and back in 2001, was
posting some very rude and offensive stuff here, he was also being accused
of being one "Gary M. Stewart" (was that ever proven?). So either there
is more than one flatfish, or flatfish has grown into a mature adult, or
as you say, expect the abuse to come soon. time will only tell. For now,
at least, i'll hold off from the kill file.

Cheers

--
Mark
Registered Linux User #329755 - http://counter.li.org
If you must email me then address to :
uk.co.demon.mwgary.nospam@mark (just reverse it and remove nospam)

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 13:11:10 +1100, Terry wrote:


Thank you!

Well I knew something had to be wrong because the system wasn't really
running any faster than my 1.2ghz and that was using PC100 memory!

The clincher was booting knoppix from a CD and seeing it scream.
The new kernel was an official SuSE kernel and pre-configured in rpm
format so it was a matter of firing up YaST and installing it.

The difference is dramatic!

Maybe, but I think anyone would have noticed that there was a problem with
performance on the original stock SMP kernel and this board in particular.

Here are the improvments for the newer kernel dated Nov 14, 2003

This kernel update fixes various problems found since the 9.0 release.
- Various ACPI fixes (T40, SCI table, IRQ floods)
- Locking problem with ide_scsi_abort
- Error handling in cdrom river fixed
- Various IPv6 fixes
- Racy last merge disabled (deadlocks on SMP machines)
- Various NFS corner cases (ACLs, TCP, locks, silly_delete)
- Patches to avoid stack overflow
- kmod UID / signal and exit_mmap update
- Fix memory leak in LVM
- Fix /proc read memory corruption
- Fix races in ISDN network device removal
- reiserfs corruption when cleaning up lost files after crash
- VIA KT400/600 support (don't use AGPv3)
- ALSA update, fixing problems with OSS emulation oopsing


Looks like some of that stuff might impact performance

Neither can I because it will save me a fortune but mostly I am starting
to get worried with the various companies whose products I own, merging,
being bought out and so forth.

My nightmare is to be stuck with orphan programs after MS creates some new
"standards" for multimedia and none of my software functions correctly and
I can't get updates because the company doesn't exist anymore.

I've said it before and I will say it again, I do not intend to upgrade to
the next version of Windows unless something radical happens with the
direction and focus of the product and that something has to be beneficial
to me and the applications that I need to run.


flatfish+++

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 21:18:26 -0700, Freeride wrote:


True on both counts.

flatfish+++

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 13:59:49 +0000, Mark Gary wrote:


Glad you enjoy my reviews!
I am not, nor have I ever been G.M.S and I will say no more about it.

flatfish+++

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 11:42:56 +0100, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

What's the matter Peter?

Did someone steal the letter Z from your bowl of alphabet soup?

flatfish+++

flatfish+++ wrote:

Nope, thief. I am simply convinced that you are not genuine. You have always
been a liar, a wintroll. And you are a thief. You have done this "review
linux favourably" routine several times. Now give me a single reason to
believe that this time it is different.

See? There is none. You are a liar, a wintroll and a thief. And will stay
that.
--
Don't abandon hope: your Tom Mix decoder ring arrives tomorrow
*

flatfish+++ wrote:

Well, you also denied being sewer_clown. Or several other low life trolls.
So, why should anyone believe you *not* being Gary M. Stewart?
--
Your conscience never stops you from doing anything. It just stops you
from enjoying it.
*

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 15:28:43 +0000, flatfish+++ wrote:

[snip]

Thats fare enough. 'Nuff said. I won't mention it again.

Mark
Registered Linux User #329755 - http://counter.li.org
If you must email me then address to :
uk.co.demon.mwgary.nospam@mark (just reverse it and remove nospam)

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 22:09:43 +0000, flatfish+++ wrote:

Flattie,
I have the same motherboard, and had some problems initally. What I found
the problem to be, is ACPI. I don't know why, but I did the default
install with the acpi enalbled kernel, and I found that one of the cpu's
had a constant 80-90% utilization, I left it like that for a few days, and
I wasn't happy with performance ( I have the same CPU as well). I found 2D
screen redraws to be very slow, icons contantly flashing with the moving
of windows, I thought this can't be right. I read somewhere in
alt.os.linux.suse about disabling ACPI with an Nvidia card ( I have a
generic GF4MX400SE). I disable it during the install, and now both
(virtual) cpu's idle normally.
I probably could have added a switch in grub.conf diabling ACPI, however I
chose to do a reinstall.
Just my personal experiences, by the way, SuSE 9.0 was the only distro
that recognized the 3Com 3c940 and installed the correct drivers. I tried
MDK 9.2, Redhat 9.0, SuSE 8.2, 8.1, and Slackware 9.1. I'm sure that I
could have installed the driver manually, but I didn't feel like it.

flatfish+++ wrote:

Still, I have seen you change your mind many times in the past. So, I
will officially not call you a wintroll on November 22, 2005.

I encourage you to keep your current persona. I enjoy your reviews.

--
11:35am up 42 days, 11:52, 1 user, load average: 1.12, 1.07, 1.01
To email me, change .com to .ca Linux Counter Registration #126647

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 13:16:49 -0500, chris-g wrote:


Bingo!!!

I never tried installing with ACPI disabled, which I suppose I should have
done, but after a default install if I used the acpi=off (of whatever it's
called) option during a boot, it worked better but it was still not right.

The newer SMP kernel on the SuSE site seems to address some issues with
ACPI so it looks like they fixed it!


With the stock SMP kernel, at least for me, it was better but not by much.
The solution as you say is to install with ACPI off.
Why it makes a difference as opposed to using the switch I don't know.

All I can say is that with the newer 4G SMP kernel the system is very fast.

Mandrake 9.2 has it in there but you have to select it at install time
because it doesn't get autodetected, and it's NOT listed under the 3com
cards. It is actually way down in the list and is called something like
sk98lin.

Not too intuitive if one is looking for something called 3com******


I'm glad you got your system going!

This board is really a very nice piece of hardware and a great deal for
the money.

flatfish+++