Not to mention that if you have Email scanning enabled *AND* the OE plug-in
enabled, you won't get a chance to open the attachment before AVG catches it.
However it is probably a good exercise in VBA.

--
George (Bindar Dundat)
This information is provided "AS IS"
It may even be wrong!
http://www.microsoft.com/security
"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote in
message news:e4zH9WGeDHA.620@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
| Lee,
|
| I'm going to give this a looking into when I return a little later today.
| Thanks a lot.
| --
| LuckyStrike
| LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
| ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| "Lee" <melee5@my-deja.com> wrote in message
| news:a57ea28d.0309102259.2e3d999c@posting.google.c om...
| > "LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote
| in message news:<e6A1Mg1dDHA.3676@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl>...
| > >
| > > OK, the latest development is that by a series of trials and errors, I
| have
| > > gotten the Macro to "work". I have placed the word work in quotes as I'm
| not
| > > sure it's really working. <G>
| > >
| > > To clarify: The command path I have made is as follows -
| > >
| > > Sub ScanItemAVG()
| > > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\\AVGSE.exe""%1\")
| > > End Sub
| > >
| > > This command has eliminated the appearance of the message box with it's
| > > accompanying "complaint". I no longer get the "Add filename to the
| command
| > > line", nor are there any "compile" or "syntax" errors either.
| > >
| > > Now when I single click upon the toolbutton(s), which are located both
| on
| > > the inbox of Outlook 2002, as well as upon the actual toolbutton area of
| an
| > > open E-mail message, the AVG Shell Extension Box appears virtually
| > > instantaneously stating "Test Finished". No Virus or suspicious files
| were
| > > detected...". So far, so good.
| > >
| > > BUT, there is an absence of any name in the "last file tested" field.
| > > Because it is blank, without any name in that field I am doubting that
| it
| > > has actually scanned anything.
| > >
| > > What might anyone make of this?
| > >
| > > Thanks yet again,
| >
| > Did you try it as below?
| > Sub ScanItemAVG()
| > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\\AVGSE.exe %1\")
| > End Sub
| >
| > I know nothing of Macros and wouldn't have commented except
| > for where you said you wanted a right click run of AVG on
| > file 'whatever'. My reg file, if imported, should give you
| > that. My attempt above at writing Macros(?) is only based on
| > the syntax that I have learned to expect as found in the
| > registry - it may or may not work when compiled(?) by
| > whatever process you are using. I don't understand the
| > need for the single double backslash just for starters.
| > Perhaps you need to also try
| >
| > Sub ScanItemAVG()
| > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\AVGSE.exe %1\")
| > End Sub
| >
| > Best of luck as I'm no more help.
|
|

Hey Bill,

Thanks for your help in following up on this for me, plus making sure my
printer works! I have printed every word that you (and Lee, C.Quirke, George
B.D., and Stefan) have so kindly provided.

C.Quirke has issued the statement (probably quite accurately; but I'm just a
"plebe" as far as this aspect- and so many others- is concerned) that my
planned item is unlikely to work. I've not tried anything further as I was
caught up in reading that which his link discussed, and then moved on to
more of his Web Site info. This wiped me out!

I shall quietly look into the details that you've offered, and see if I can
learn something.

And yeah, How do I make a button that says "Hello World"? Can you help me
with that? *<:-Þ
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...=Google+Search

Never did I realize that PC's could be so much fun!

Thanks very much,
--
LuckyStrike ;-)
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m

"Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
news:%23Q6qvCBeDHA.2260@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...

For Hello World, try this page and pick your language of choice.
http://www.roesler-ac.de/wolfram/hello.htm
--
George (Bindar Dundat)
This information is provided "AS IS"
It may even be wrong!
http://www.microsoft.com/security
"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote in
message news:e0TTdZVeDHA.3528@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
| Hey Bill,
|
| Thanks for your help in following up on this for me, plus making sure my
| printer works! I have printed every word that you (and Lee, C.Quirke, George
| B.D., and Stefan) have so kindly provided.
|
| C.Quirke has issued the statement (probably quite accurately; but I'm just a
| "plebe" as far as this aspect- and so many others- is concerned) that my
| planned item is unlikely to work. I've not tried anything further as I was
| caught up in reading that which his link discussed, and then moved on to
| more of his Web Site info. This wiped me out!
|
| I shall quietly look into the details that you've offered, and see if I can
| learn something.
|
| And yeah, How do I make a button that says "Hello World"? Can you help me
| with that? *<:-Þ
|
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...=Google+Search
|
| Never did I realize that PC's could be so much fun!
|
| Thanks very much,
| --
| LuckyStrike ;-)
| LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
|
| "Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
| news:%23Q6qvCBeDHA.2260@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
| > "LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote
| in message news:#BEUQl1dDHA.1632@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
| > > "Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
| > > news:Ozq6zT1dDHA.2816@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
| >
| > > > > Sub ScanItemAVG()
| > > > > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\avgse.exe")
| > > > > End Sub
| > > >
| > > > The above code calls avgse.exe but you also need to pass a filename
| > > > to the program. How else would the program know what file you
| > > > want to scan?
| >
| > > > Basically, you need to "get" the file object first, and then pass off
| the
| > > > the file's name property to AVG. The question I think, is, how to get
| the
| > > > file.name ?
| >
| > > Hi Bill-
| >
| > Hey LS!
| >
| > > The "file" I am trying to scan is an E-mail message with attachments
| that is
| > > in my Outlook 2002 inbox. The reason for this desire to create a simple
| > > basic "Scan this Item, Now" toolbutton is to eliminate the need to click
| > > upon the attachment, sending it to a folder named "Scan for Virus" and
| then
| > > R-Clicking the "Scan with AVG" command. I have found a way to correctly
| > > enter the command without errors, thus eliminating the problem of my
| initial
| > > query.
| > >
| > > The command path I have made is as follows -
| > >
| > > Sub ScanItemAVG()
| > > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\\AVGSE.exe""%1\")
| > > End Sub
| >
| > I don't think that will ever work. To see why, pass "%1\", or any of your
| > permutations, to msgbox. You are trying to pass the simple string "%1\".
| >
| > msgbox "%1\"
| >
| > Hint: msgbox is your friend when debugging. If you can't get the desired
| > string or value to display in msgbox, then passing it to other processes
| > is a waste of time.
| >
| > But! First off, your attachment doesn't even exist as a file, which I
| assume
| > is the necessary parameter needed by avgse.exe. You may need to save the
| > attachment as a "temp" file, scan the file, and then delete the temp file.
| I
| > think that would be doable.
| >
| > Just as an example, try this with your eicar attachment.
| >
| > Set Att = Item.Attachments(1) 'get the first
| attachment object
| > sAttName = Att.FileName 'get its name
| > sAttPathName = "c:\windows\temp\" & sAttName 'put together a full
| path\name.
| > MsgBox sAttPathName 'debug command
| > Att.SaveAsFile sAttPathName
| > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\AVGSE.exe " & sAttPathName) 'note
| space after .exe
| >
| > I'm not familiar with Outlook or its macros at all, or much VB, and I'm
| not sure of
| > the varaious properties, methods, and objects in Outlooks case. But give
| that a try.
| > Also, that's just an example, and there are other things that need to be
| done,
| > such as getting the %temp% dir, and looping through all the attachments of
| an
| > email, as well as testing if an attachment exists, and cleaning up.
| >
| >
| > But can you pass an attachment "object" directly to AVG? Dunno.. I guess
| you
| > could try and see what happens.
| >
| > Set Att = Item.Attachments(1) 'get attachment object
| > Shell ("C:\Program Files\Grisoft\AVG6\AVGSE.exe " & Att) 'note the space
| after .exe
| >
| >
| >
| > > That's the latest development in this "simple" <G> saga.
| >
| > Couldn't you start your programming career with something a little
| simpler?
| > Like a button to display "Hello world"?
| >
| >
| >
| >
|
|

You may want to try the microsoft.public.outlook.program_vba group

--
George (Bindar Dundat)
This information is provided "AS IS"
It may even be wrong!
http://www.microsoft.com/security
"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote in
message news:%23Pic7UydDHA.2176@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
| If these are the wrong NG's for this issue, would someone be so kind as to
| direct me to the proper one?
|
| I have created a couple of Macros for Outlook 2002 (a part of Office XP).
| The first Macro is to enable the direct one click running of my AV scanner;
| a new tool button was created for this purpose. It Works beautifully. The
| only shortcoming was it scans *everything*; this is way too lengthy a
| process.
|
| I then created a second Macro to run the Shell extension (AVGSE.exe.) of AVG
| AV, the purpose of which is to simply scan the one item in question. It's
| not quite done yet as a problem arose.
|
| Here is the problem: When I attempt to run it, a small message box appears
| which states the following information - AVG Simple Checker. Add Filename to
| the command line.
|
| What is meant by this exactly and how/where do I perform this?
|
| Thanks,
| --
| LuckyStrike
| LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
|
|

I'm grateful for the wealth of info that I've found in your work. Most -if
not all- is way over my head, but I am certain that those whose
understanding is on par with your own will *really* appreciate the time and
effort you've put into it.

I've added your site to my knowledge database, and will surely refer to it
on a regular basis.

Thanks again, ;-)
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message
news:5641mvor1tf836b9p3igheq3cm6r9annmu@4ax.com...

Slowly, but surely I will enter the portals of the 2235 + NG's (Japanese,
Turkish, etc. notwithstanding) and see what they are about.

Outlook.program_vba escaped my attention. That's a good idea George; Thanks
a lot.
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
-----------------------------------------------------------------------


"George (Bindar Dundat)" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message
news:uMVCxtVeDHA.1760@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...

Please...You'll regret sending me there. How do I .....?? ;-)
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
---------------------------------------------------------
"George (Bindar Dundat)" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message
news:%23CiC$rVeDHA.3616@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...

YW

--
George (Bindar Dundat)
This information is provided "AS IS"
It may even be wrong!
http://www.microsoft.com/security
"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote in
message news:Owg8$xVeDHA.1908@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
| Slowly, but surely I will enter the portals of the 2235 + NG's (Japanese,
| Turkish, etc. notwithstanding) and see what they are about.
|
| Outlook.program_vba escaped my attention. That's a good idea George; Thanks
| a lot.
| --
| LuckyStrike
| LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
| -----------------------------------------------------------------------
|
|
| "George (Bindar Dundat)" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message
| news:uMVCxtVeDHA.1760@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
| > You may want to try the microsoft.public.outlook.program_vba group
| >
| > --
| > George (Bindar Dundat)
| > This information is provided "AS IS"
| > It may even be wrong!
| > http://www.microsoft.com/security
| > "LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote
| in
| > message news:%23Pic7UydDHA.2176@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
| > | If these are the wrong NG's for this issue, would someone be so kind as
| to
| > | direct me to the proper one?
| > |
| > | I have created a couple of Macros for Outlook 2002 (a part of Office
| XP).
| > | The first Macro is to enable the direct one click running of my AV
| scanner;
| > | a new tool button was created for this purpose. It Works beautifully.
| The
| > | only shortcoming was it scans *everything*; this is way too lengthy a
| > | process.
| > |
| > | I then created a second Macro to run the Shell extension (AVGSE.exe.) of
| AVG
| > | AV, the purpose of which is to simply scan the one item in question.
| It's
| > | not quite done yet as a problem arose.
| > |
| > | Here is the problem: When I attempt to run it, a small message box
| appears
| > | which states the following information - AVG Simple Checker. Add
| Filename to
| > | the command line.
| > |
| > | What is meant by this exactly and how/where do I perform this?
| > |
| > | Thanks,
| > | --
| > | LuckyStrike
| > | LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
| > |
| > |
| >
|
|

Been a good exercise for sure, and I've learned a bit in the process. The
trouble is the trouble it has created for me, and for others trying to
explain this. Doubtless my efforts would be better served in learning things
more basic.

Thanks for your patience and persistence George!
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
-------------------------------------------------------------------
"George (Bindar Dundat)" <JustMe@nothome.net> wrote in message
news:eXe3r2HeDHA.2144@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...

I am certain, that:

1) You are right in general.
2) It's probably too labor intensive for the "effort" that's saved.
3) It's beyond my immediate capabilities to comprehend, master, and
implement.
4) The resulting "loose ends" leftover from a positive scan, if unattended
to, would be "hazardous" and expose one repeatedly to the same thing.
5) I'll come back when I "grow up" (as I've only 8 months experience using a
PC) and can more fully appreciate the method and wisdom that you have so
kindly bestowed upon me. But I'll read and re-read it countless times to see
if I get it.

Thanks very much -
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
"cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message
news:5s94mvobftoe09bctvcinprme71e5r1j43@4ax.com...

On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 20:05:43 -0600, "LuckyStrike"

You've come a long way in 8 months - did you do other computers
beforehand? I did 4 years on pre-PCs before my first PC.

What you were thinking of doing has got me thinking too. :-)

Half the problem I had as a programmer was finding things that need to
be written. That was easy before I got into MSware, because my first
platforms were "minority" and there weren't already 5 different
programs to anything you needed.

So for example, a new custom disk interface would need a raw sector
editor, a particular printer would need a screen dump program, there
were endless cases of protected cassette-based programs that owners
wanted to load off disk instead, and PICK needed just about anything
that wasn't database-related.

When I took up with DOS, I found I seldom if ever needed to program,
so I sank into userdom :-)


In your case, you've made me consider the automation of what I so
often have to do manually...

1) Import mail from OE, splitting out attachments
2) Scan and clean attachments
3) Trace positive attachments back to messages that brought them in
4) Delete these messages in OE, and again from Trash

A similar approach would be needed for Outlook's .pst, and the other
challenge would be to handle SR data (more on that later). If all
this could be done on NTFS via a mOS, you'd start to regain control of
this naked-emperor environment.

In each case, you'd have a malware-harbouring environment on one side,
and an av on the other. I'd code specifically for the first, but
generalise for the second. If I got this right, I'd first safeguard
my copyright before punting this to av vendors as an extension of
their products, or release it as a stand-alone thing for use with
whatever av the user wanted to use (supporting stacked av calls).

There are several things that bode well for the ability to get
"inside" OE's mail data format:
- Eudora's ability to import mail (best at Eudora 5.02)
- utilities written that can recover from or repair OE mail data
- OE's ability to break out a single message+attachments as .eml

What may be less easy is the ability to rebuild an OE mailbox in a way
that's fully OE-compatible. If you have that ability, you could:
- break out, clean up, and re-incorporate arbitrary selected msgs
- scan, rebuild, and incidentally compact one or all mailboxes

It would be really nice to patch malware scanning and cleaning into
the standard OE mail compaction routine - I have a feeling that this
code does much of the work required, and just needs a patch-in point
(that should be protected against malware use of course!)


On SR (System Restore, applicable in different ways to WinME and XP)
you'd need to be able to edit SR's file tracking data and navigate
..cab files, in order to clean or delete files within SR's data and
correct the metadata so that SR restore is still possible.

You'd want to disclaimer against some inevitable broken-atom effects
in the readme, especially when files are deleted - e.g. where there
are registry or private-file links to the deleted file, an SR restore
could create a non-working state.

The genreral approach has malware potential too, if a malware could
forge an SR checkpoint and then restore this state as a way in.

"cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message
news:0nu5mv0casodos2le35d53pp12n6ubvrlt@4ax.com...
Hi CQuirke,

This message of yours has also been printed for reference. There's so little
I really understand in this regard. As is said "I am out of my league" when
asking for answers in this particular area.

Insofar as PC's are concerned, I never even sat in front of one before the
end of 2002. So I have managed to only "do mine", much to the relief of many
a person I'm sure. Naturally, it would have been beneficial to have had
access to someone else's to learn with, but then it's doubtful we would
still be friends! ;-) This being as it is would serve to explain why quite
often I simply "don't get it".

Your abilities in Programming are well placed, and doubtless, hard earned. I
am pleased to have provided you with an "idea" or thought, and I trust you
will do well in creating a way to implement it.

Regards,
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Bill,

Well you've done just about everything but test it out for me. If You've
been following this thread -and it appears you have and more- <g> you will
have gathered that this is still a bit beyond me. That I was able to make
the first one which actually worked is in and of itself a miracle of sorts.

Due to the "density" of information that you and C.Quirke (amongst others)
have offered, I have printed all of these so as to have them available for
prompting as I plod ahead on this. Please excuse me in my inability to
provide an immediate result from all of your help. The day may yet come in
which I can say "guess what...". By then you may be a considerably older
person then you now are. (That didn't come out sounding quite as I had
intended!) <G>

Thanks for the links, help, and suggestions. And I don't want a battle with
"Hal" so I will be cautious. ;-)


Sincerely,
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
news:OnIyfSleDHA.3200@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...

Yes, I understand everything you've written this time CQuirke. Especially
the E=MC squared and the quantum mechanics part. ;-)

And it is nice to meet you as I am your friend too. I am simply a walking
"error message". <g>
--
LuckyStrike
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message
news:ukg8mv8g24841sedup048nqu19m1psjsuv@4ax.com...

"cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message news:ukg8mv8g24841sedup048nqu19m1psjsuv@4ax.com...
I found this out when I first connected to the "WWW". Before that I was
writing up a storm, and had plenty of "original" ideas. When connected
I found everything I was doing, or had ideas for, had already been
done. (100 times!)

I think it might be the other way around. Frustrated script-kiddies are
drawn to asm, because they've heard that you can do anything in asm,
and leave a small footprint. The folks in alt.lang.asm frequently chase
away kiddies that come in and ask things like "hey dudes, how do I write
to a boot sector.." or "how to get inside a PE, without damaging it".


Yep, you don't see many (I can only recall one, but not the name) Window's
programs, with a GUI, written in pure asm. I imagine even complex drivers or
kernel stuff are mostly C with inline asm where needed. The code for my
washing machine interface or my carbuerator might be coded in 100%
asm. ;-)

Mabey why basic lives on, is because it got so much exposure when
MS "gave" it away.

Not necessarily so, but standard libraries make things easier. Of course,
if you are writing a "windows program", then you have to include MS.

Heh.. here too. Boland Turbo C++ 3.0 for DOS. Back in the day when
they would give you a 1000 pg manual with two sets of disks. Now you
get the same "manual size" box, open it and there is one CD rattling
around in the bottom of the box. I still have the unused 5.25 disks wrapped
in the plastic. I only used it to write and compile a little C. No C++. Never
really comprehended "OOP". Classes, inheritance, constructors/destructors,
ugh. ;-/ I was more a procedure oriented only programmer. POOP. <g>

To quote the quotable PCR.
"Ok then."
;-)

"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om> wrote in message news:ud1raAoeDHA.3616@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...

Right then.
--
LuckyStrike ;-)
LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
"Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
news:OQpIiCteDHA.2152@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...

Bill Blanton wrote:
I always liked Turbo Pascal, up until that the OOPS stuff came in. I always
thought it was a beautiful and *self documenting* language, unlike C. And it
had some hooks into the hardware, but admitedly not as many as C. So when C
took over, I think Turbo Pascal just bit the dust. I was really sorry to see
it go, as "C" (to me) is too cryptic. If I want cryptic, I'd use ASM. (LOL)

You are right about Pascal Bill. I just finished working on a project that I
want to totally re-code in Pascal.

--
George (Bindar Dundat ©)
This information is provided "AS IS"
It may even be wrong! ©
http://snurl.com/2bvl
"Bill in Co" <none@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:O3dFiAueDHA.1752@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
| Bill Blanton wrote:
| > "cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote in message
| > news:ukg8mv8g24841sedup048nqu19m1psjsuv@4ax.com...
| >> On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 14:33:10 -0600, "LuckyStrike"
| >>> "cquirke" <name.goes.here@nospam.iafrica.com> wrote
| >>>> You've come a long way in 8 months - did you do other computers
| >>>> beforehand? I did 4 years on pre-PCs before my first PC.
| >>
| >>>> Half the problem I had as a programmer was finding things that need to
| >>>> be written. When I took up with DOS, I found I seldom if ever needed
| >>>> to program, so I sank into userdom :-)
| >
| > I found this out when I first connected to the "WWW". Before that I was
| > writing up a storm, and had plenty of "original" ideas. When connected
| > I found everything I was doing, or had ideas for, had already been
| > done. (100 times!)
| >
| >>> Your abilities in Programming are well placed, and doubtless, hard earned.
| I
| >>> am pleased to have provided you with an "idea" or thought, and I trust you
| >>> will do well in creating a way to implement it.
| >>
| >> Alas, I'm not a programmer anymore - my natural languages of assembly
| >> and BASIC aren't that useful to me anymore, and I'm not up to speed
| >> with the API calls I'd have to use.
| >>
| >> Assembler's great for micro-coding small projects, and perhaps that's
| >> why frustrated asm coders might be drawn to malware.
| >
| > I think it might be the other way around. Frustrated script-kiddies are
| > drawn to asm, because they've heard that you can do anything in asm,
| > and leave a small footprint. The folks in alt.lang.asm frequently chase
| > away kiddies that come in and ask things like "hey dudes, how do I write
| > to a boot sector.." or "how to get inside a PE, without damaging it".
| >
| >
| >> To tackle a
| >> large job in asm is like drawing a 1024x768 wallpaper one dot at a
| >> time, instead of (say) scanning a picture or taking snaps with a
| >> digital camera and then massaging those.
| >
| > Yep, you don't see many (I can only recall one, but not the name) Window's
| > programs, with a GUI, written in pure asm. I imagine even complex drivers or
| > kernel stuff are mostly C with inline asm where needed. The code for my
| > washing machine interface or my carbuerator might be coded in 100%
| > asm. ;-)
| >
| >> BASIC lives on, but it's a bit like English - there are so many
| >> dialects that it quickly becomes a babylon. Good BASICs have become
| >> more shapely after acquiring better flow structure syntax from other
| >> langauges such as Pascal, but it's still an ugly beast, full of
| >> reserved words and dialectized syntax.
| >
| > Mabey why basic lives on, is because it got so much exposure when
| > MS "gave" it away.
| >
| >> The language I'd like to work in is C or C++, as I really admire its
| >> machine elegance and am flattered by the full low-level control it
| >> offers. Then again, that low-level control requires consistent clue
| >> on the part of the programmer, and that is seldom met - hence all the
| >> "unchecked buffer" holes, for example.
| >>
| >> C (and C++) has a small set of reserved words and consistant syntax,
| >> but knowing these won't make you a useful C(++) programmer. Nearly
| >> everything requires the use of libraries of other programmers' code,
| >> and figuring out the mindset of these is a pain. In effect, this
| >> re-imposes the tedium of large vocabularies and ideosyncratic syntax.
| >
| > Not necessarily so, but standard libraries make things easier. Of course,
| > if you are writing a "windows program", then you have to include MS.
| >
| >> That was C++ as it was when I bounced off the learning wall, way back
| >> in the Borlan C++ version 3.0 days :-)
| >
| > Heh.. here too. Boland Turbo C++ 3.0 for DOS. Back in the day when
| > they would give you a 1000 pg manual with two sets of disks. Now you
| > get the same "manual size" box, open it and there is one CD rattling
| > around in the bottom of the box. I still have the unused 5.25 disks wrapped
| > in the plastic. I only used it to write and compile a little C. No C++.
Never
| > really comprehended "OOP". Classes, inheritance, constructors/destructors,
| > ugh. ;-/ I was more a procedure oriented only programmer. POOP. <g>
|
| I always liked Turbo Pascal, up until that the OOPS stuff came in. I always
| thought it was a beautiful and *self documenting* language, unlike C. And it
| had some hooks into the hardware, but admitedly not as many as C. So when C
| took over, I think Turbo Pascal just bit the dust. I was really sorry to see
| it go, as "C" (to me) is too cryptic. If I want cryptic, I'd use ASM. (LOL)
|
|

OK, bye.

--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR
pcrrcp@netzero.net
"LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om>
wrote in message news:uRPZ0NteDHA.3200@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
| Right then.
| --
| LuckyStrike ;-)
| LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.co m
| ----------------------------------------------------------------------
------
| -----
| "Bill Blanton" <bblanton@REMOVEmagicnet.net> wrote in message
| news:OQpIiCteDHA.2152@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
| > To quote the quotable PCR.
| > "Ok then."
| > ;-)
| >
| > "LuckyStrike" <LS@smokedamagedfurniture.youcandriveitawaytoday.c om>
wrote
| in message news:ud1raAoeDHA.3616@TK2MSFTNGP11.phx.gbl...
| >
| > > Thanks for the links, help, and suggestions. And I don't want a
battle
| with
| > > "Hal" so I will be cautious. ;-)
| > >
| >
| >
|
|